Cool Coffee w/ Kansas Principals

CC#71: Retirement Reflections w/ Retiring Principals

In this episode of Cool Coffee, retiring principals Greg Oborny and JJ Libal, of USD 233 in Olathe, share their experiences and insights from their long careers in education. They discuss the importance of building relationships, the challenges of critical conversations, and the best advice they received throughout their journeys. The conversation emphasizes the need for visibility, integrity, and humor in leadership, while also preparing new administrators for the emotional and practical challenges they will face. Ultimately, the focus remains on the students and the impact educators can have on their lives. In this conversation, two experienced principals reflect on their careers, discussing the challenges and rewards of leadership in education. They share insights on the importance of giving, transitioning leadership, and the cherished memories that define their journeys. As they prepare for retirement, they express gratitude for their experiences and look forward to new adventures while emphasizing the human element of their roles.
See below for more on this episode, to connect with the host, and learn more about the KPA and the Cool Coffee Podcast.
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Chapters (timestamps do not account for intro music)
00:00 Introduction to the Principals' Journey04:53 Lessons from Early Administration12:12 The Best Advice for New Administrators19:40 Navigating the Challenges of Leadership25:53 The Principalship: Giving and Growing27:00 Transitioning Leadership: Leaving a Legacy31:57 Cherished Memories: Celebrating the Journey37:52 Future Endeavors: Embracing Change43:08 Reflections and Gratitude: The Human Element of Leadership
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The mission of the Kansas Principals Association, an organization committed to educational excellence and the lifelong success of all students, is to develop and support all principals through optimized learning, collaborative leadership, networking, and service.
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FULL TRANSCRIPT (AI generated)
Rick Sola (00:01.076)All right. Hello. Welcome to Cool Coffee, another edition, a special edition. And we will, we'll just call this a Princi-pals segment because I've got two of my own Princi-pals and I've got to give credit where credit's due. I did not come up with that. That was a former principal friend of mine, Justin Howe, who I've mentioned on this show before. He had the idea of Principals and he is a former principal now in the HR world. So I try not to bring him up too often.
But anyway, so we have some principals here with Mr. JJ Libal and Mr. Greg Oborny, and I'll let them introduce themselves here in a little bit, but they are both retiring principals after long, very successful careers in the chair. And so this is going to be a podcast where some shared wisdom will be given to the millions of listeners of Cool Coffee. And we will start by just doing a quick
introduction. I'll let you introduce yourself. Greg O. Let's hear about you.
Grego (01:05.146)All right, well, I'm Greg Oborny. I've been with the Olathe District Schools for 39 years. I started my career as a first grade teacher, then was an instructional reading coach, was principal at Northview Elementary for four years, and then have been at the last 25 years. I opened Regency Place and have been here and now am going to live life outside the principalship. Yeah, crazy. Turn 60. What happens?
There's life. That's me.
Rick Sola (01:38.008)Perfect. And we'll get more into it. And I should have started with this. And this is not any indication of the company that we have on this show, but this has always been able to maintain a family-friendly rating of podcast. And so I know you're retiring and you're both going out the door, but just for the record, we're a family-friendly show. And I'm kind of joking. I'm not setting you guys up at all. But JJ.
a quick road to the chair that you are about to vacate.
J.J. (02:12.948)Sure, JJ Libal, I'm the retiring principal at Santa Fe Trail Middle School, the best middle school in Olathe, no offense, Rick Sola. But it is, right, right. Yeah, 19 years in Olathe School District, really 15 years as an administrator, all in Olathe. Started off, I'm a farm kid from Southeast Nebraska, and I've taught, my previous career, I've taught in
Rick Sola (02:22.926)I take a little, but go ahead.
J.J. (02:41.968)small 1A schools. First teaching job I was the entire social studies department for the high school to urban setting in KCK and then to Olathe. And I was in Olathe as a teacher for four years before I moved over to the assistant principal role at a couple of different middle schools including Santa Fe Trail where I'm at now and retiring after nine years at Santa Fe Trail as a principal.
Rick Sola (03:09.42)Well, full disclosure, like I said, this is a, we'll call it princi-pals, but JJ and I go back to our coaching days. We coached against each other, each other. were both basketball coaches or social studies teachers together at different schools, but same, same grade level. So we go way back. And then Greg, Greg, I've gotten to know him more in the more recent years. And I think my only regret is I didn't connect with you sooner.
Greg and so but it's it's awesome to be able to connect with you on here
Grego (03:41.736)middle school principals are such a elite group. You know, I've always been so intimidated and we elementary principals, you know, are not really worthy to be amongst the middle school and secondary folks. But once I finally gained, you know, entry into the secret club with the handshake and all, I have just been so honored and have lots of new insights into your middle school principal ways.
Rick Sola (04:09.89)Well, I think the barrier that you broke and it's it's apropos that you're wearing a quarter zip right now because once you were a quarter zip at one point and we said, you know what? think he he could he could be part of the middle school club that in a polo, right? Dry fit. Yeah, OK.
Grego (04:22.536)Yeah, it was dry fit, dry fit. Elementary folks aren't always into dry fit, but I've learned your ways and now. Comfort, extreme comfort.
Rick Sola (04:31.722)Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's perfect. Well, I'm going to have you both go back and kind of go back to the deep memories of early in your educational career to your first year as an administrator. And just for the record here, first year for you, Greg, in administration, what year would that have been?
Grego (04:53.682)Probably like 95.
Rick Sola (04:55.638)Okay, and then JJ.
J.J. (04:58.181)in 2010.
Rick Sola (05:00.238)2010. Okay. What was the first hard lesson that you learned as an administrator?
J.J. (05:10.204)You know, I think for, go ahead, Greg. Okay, so I think, you know, one of the things that I was not as adept at early on was crucial conversations, hard conversations, critical conversation, whatever you wanna call those. You know, I think that...
Grego (05:10.408)I remember, you go JJ.
J.J. (05:33.652)That was something that I did not understand as well in the beginning and how to do those well and did some work and some reading on that and some practice with that. I think that that was something that I think you have to learn, especially if you're coming from the classroom and if you're gonna be working in the same building as an administrator that you had taught.
understanding that relationships change. They change and you know now you're the boss, you're the supervisor and you know.
you're looked at a little bit differently at that point. And I would say even between, and you know, at the elementary world with Greg, I mean, I will say this, like nobody works harder than elementary principals, elementary teachers, because it's you, right? You're the one. You're the one in that classroom, you're the one in that building. you know, there's even a different relationship that I would see as being the assistant principal to the principal chair with staff. So I would say that was a lesson that I, or something that I got better at,
wish I'd learned a little bit earlier.
Grego (06:45.096)Right on track, perfect on those critical conversations that just comes with experience, I think, and you have several of them and you botch them and then you master it. I remember the first time I thought that as a principal, I could make a directive and ask people to do something and just assume they would do it. That was really early on. I had asked my new staff, said, everybody's going to do
classroom newsletter. Now I'd like for you to do it weekly, but I understand that monthly may be more up some of your alley as we get used to this, but it's going to promote home and school communication and this is just something you've never done and it's going to be great. And the SPED people said, no we don't do that.
That's going to be a with IEPs. Nope, we can't. And I said, well, let's talk about then perhaps the objectives that you're working on with content in all of your IEP sessions. No, we're not going to do it. And I went, but yeah. OK.
And so after that, thought, hmm, I'm going to have to learn how to throw things out there, get a response from people, get critical mass, and get feedback and buy-in because saying, we are going to do this, doesn't work.
Rick Sola (08:24.056)Did you, at what point did you pull out the I am the principal card? Did that ever come out? I've always heard that if that's something that has to be said, then there's a lot that's lost at that point.
Grego (08:39.524)I was scared to say that after that moment and thought I'm just going to have to be craftier and smarter in conveying that thought but helping people realize that they're coming up with the idea and the initiative of which we need to do.
Rick Sola (08:59.043)Yeah.
J.J. (08:59.22)Just to add on that, Greg, I think you bring up a great point. I mean, I think we've all been in that situation. One thing that I found about three or four years ago, think, actually was around COVID when we were all online and looking for professional learning and all those things was a decision-making matrix.
And actually I got kind of a hard time from my staff because they would give me a hard time. Okay, is this a level one? Is this a level two? Is this a level five decision? And make fun of me for it. But then that actually kind of told me that they were paying attention to it. And that kind of helped some because I could say, know, like Greg, I love that term critical mass. Wish I would have heard that a few years ago. Thanks for just sharing that with me now, Greg. Could have used that a while back. But no, I think the idea of the same, yeah.
Grego (09:44.52)you
It's vintage.
J.J. (09:49.47)Timing, my timing is always impeccable. But I think that that is important because there are times where you have to put on that boss hat. But you don't wanna do that every day. There are times where I call it the boss hat. said, hey, this one's a level one. It's a boss hat, right? Like I'm gonna make this decision. But I often call things, hey, going into this decision, it's a level two. And so that means I'm making the decision, but I'm going to get input from you first.
And so if there are any complaints or concerns after that, I can say, well, you knew how the decision was going to be made before I made the decision. so, you know, I understand you're giving your feedback that way, you know? And so I think that helped me a little bit, but I agree with Greg. You know, can't pull that boss card out all the time, right? You have to figure out other ways.
Rick Sola (10:42.157)Yeah.
So for the record, I hope a little bit of facetiousness came across in that comment. The I am the principal. I kind of go back to the old Center at Life skit with Will Ferrell where he's sitting around the table and getting frustrated because no one's listening and he's like, I drive a Dodge Stratus. I'm in charge of 23 people. I'm a big deal. Yeah, I don't think that's a sign that things are going really well when we have to do that. But you know, some really good stuff there. And yeah, to go back to those early
years and I do think that that's a real challenge early on especially all throughout the principalship but early on especially because Greg alluded to it earlier. We learn from getting burned. We get better at it. But in those early years we don't have the experience to draw on or the foundation or the confidence is probably a big part of that as well to be able just like you said you're like, yeah, I don't know.
But that's a really uncomfortable place to live in. And that's really where our early principals live on the daily. I mean, I remember that. I see both of you shaking your head. think that's really just kind of a reality. So you've kind of gotten through all that. At some point along the way, you received what you probably would coin as the best advice you ever got as an administrator. What advice did you receive?
perhaps early on that you just felt like, just like JJ just said, man, I wish I had known that earlier. But you hear something from all the mentors and all the people that we work around that are so great. Greg, we'll start with you. Best advice that you received early on in your principalships.
Grego (12:33.128)Well, we talk about it every day at school now, especially starting the year. It's the power of building relationships. You know, we want teachers to build relationships with students and have that rapport and have authentic and real connections. And when we do that, students, there's lots of teaching and learning. They make progress and it's good all around. And I think people definitely have to be real.
principals have to be real with their staff and you've got to have relationships. I had one teacher say, Greg, I don't know what it is, but suddenly you do these Jedi mind tricks and you know, here we're all doing student led conferences and you know, it's just, it's that trust. They trust you, you trust them and you have relationships. And like when, when JJ said those,
critical conversations, that's when you have faith in yourself that you can do those things and they can come from a place of, if I were you, I would want to know. I use that phrase a lot. If I were you, I'd really want to know. So let's talk about it. And then you have that relationship built and the rapport, and then you work through those things.
Rick Sola (13:47.522)Mm-hmm.
Rick Sola (13:58.446)Yeah, and you always hope that those conversations are coming after you've built all those relationships and you've got so many deposits. Greg, as far as, you know, 39 years in education, Intentional steps that you have. mean, you're a very natural people person. The things that you do in your building to really kind of just always keep the relationship fire going with your staff. What are one or two of those things that you do?
Grego (14:09.8)Correct.
Grego (14:29.522)think we have to have humor. Yesterday at the elementary principals, was talking about the principals handbook, which is this made up entity that I use on my morning show with students about, you know, students and the principals handbook, because you only get the handbook after you go to principal school. And it's the knowledge of all the principals that have come before you. And whenever you have a question, principals go to the principal handbook. And you know,
We had a big snow last night students and in the principal handbook it says on page 1429, remind students to leave snow where nature intended it on the ground. And of course I got a principal handbook from my staff on my last day. I think humor has to be part of it. And you know another thing is just the integrity.
I we all know what we're supposed to do. That little voice that tells you what is the right thing to do. And when there's contentious conversations, parents, students, and we are attacked, I always just tell myself, what is the right thing to do? I really want to say this. I really want to make this point and have the last word. That's not the right thing. What does integrity tell you you need to do? So that's my guiding principle, integrity, humor.
and build your relationships and the rest of Scarborough's Rope and the Seal of Literacy and learning objectives, learning intentions, teacher clarity, those things will fall into place after you have those big pillars of what we just talked about.
Rick Sola (16:17.1)No, I love that. And I love the principal handbook. That might be something I need to steal and just kind of reference, especially to kids. love the, well, now you know, I've got the handbook here. no, that's really great there. JJ, best advice.
Grego (16:28.712)You
J.J. (16:35.42)Yeah, I think two things. One, I heard from an assistant principal when I was teaching that I worked with. And I really didn't think about it until I obviously became a principal. But there are very few emergencies in education. obviously,
You know, we had bad weather last night. That's right. An emergency takes shelter. But other than that, there are very few emergencies. There's why I know that one thing that I learned when I made a decision too quickly.
and didn't take to 48 hours, usually did not go as well. And I know that can be frustrating to staff sometimes because they want an answer right now. But I try to remind myself there are very few things in education that can't wait 24 to 48 hours. Like Greg said, before you respond to that email, before you say something, give yourself push pause, I guess would be the shorter version of that. Number two would be visibility.
And I would say I credit Mike Wolgast for that, who I worked with at Pioneer Trail. And I really didn't understand that until I became a principal. But I heard just to a tell here, Mike, tell me all the time, be visible. And so many of parents may not make it into the building, but they see you out there at the crosswalk. In my case, they saw me weed eating because that's what I like to do. And they thought it was just for the school, but it was also for me because it part of my therapy.
But that means so much to staff and to students and to parents, right? That they are visible. We see you at every game. We see you at every concert. Not that you have to attend all those things the entire time, but when you're there, and I would add one thing to that, active visibility. So when you're there, you fist bumping parents? Hello, nice to see you again. Thanks for coming tonight. How's it? So being actively visible and being...
J.J. (18:32.424)and then really pushing pause on things that do not need a decision right now.
Rick Sola (18:39.446)Yeah, no, that's great. I love that active visibility piece because sometimes it, don't know, we can be visible, but there's a million things rattling through our brains. And so it's easy to not be engaged with whatever it is. It could be just a supervision of a, concert or basketball game, to be, to be active, I love that. as, yeah, as we transition still along the line of advice, but
thinking to someone who may come to you, you hey, JJ Gregg, I'm starting my very first principalship or I'm starting my very first role in administration. You have years and wealth of wisdom, which is a lot of experience. What would you want to impart or what advice would you want to give to someone who is asking you in June before August for some advice?
J.J. (19:40.958)Greg, I'll let you start on that one. I'm still thinking about it.
Rick Sola (19:42.21)Hahaha.
Grego (19:45.052)Well, I'm going to be totally blunt and family friendly on this response. But when someone comes to me and says they're interested in the Principalship Administration, my first question to them is, are you sure you want to come to the dark side? And they'll go, what? And I say, yes, this is the Darth Vader dark side. You have.
great highs in this job, but there are some lows and the depths that will rock your health, your mental health, your physical health, your family life, and you've got to be prepared to work on balance and know that the work is never done. You will never be good enough.
There's always going to be someone that's unhappy with the decision you've made or you haven't met their needs. Your needs are going to be secondary to your staff, your students, your community. You will not get to show true emotions because you're going to be a leader. And it's going to take over your entire life. And
It's just the best thing ever at times. And it is awful at times. And you've got to have thick skin. So you better get yourself a good moisturizer, some sunscreen, and be prepared because it will impact every aspect of your life. And you probably will earn about $15 an hour when it's all said and done with the amount of time
Rick Sola (21:18.702)You
Grego (21:34.854)that it takes in your existence. Are you ready to come to the dark side?
They look at me and often go, thanks Mr. O, I'll think about this. To me it's the truth though.
Rick Sola (21:52.62)Yeah. But you know, wrapped up in all of that, all the challenges you said, but it's the best and there's so much to love about it. And I've said on this show before many times, just how I do think the principalship is the best job in education. There's just so many things with it. It doesn't mean it's easy. If it feels easy, we're probably not doing it the right way.
J.J. (22:18.132)and
Rick Sola (22:19.264)And I love that you shared all that because I think anybody who's listening to this can probably relate pretty deeply with all of that. But it's also encouraging as a reminder of what it is that we're doing. And Greg, I bet you've had former students now, I 39 years in education, I mean, they're well into adulthood. There's probably some grandkids that are coming through. The profound impact that you've had and what better legacy is there than to positively impact.
kids and families. But there's a sacrifice that comes with it. that's great advice. JJ.
J.J. (22:57.3)It's always about the kids for me, you know, and love what Greg said there. You know, decisions that you make that are best for kids are not always going to be what's most convenient for adults. And so I think you have to keep that in mind because one thing that I would tell a new administrator coming in is that you will not...
I cannot prepare you for the number of adult things that you will deal with, with dealing with adults as much or more that you deal with kids. Because you have to remember that you're taking on everything else too. Anything that is personal and going on in their lives, a divorce, a breakup, a...
you know, passing, that all comes to you as the principle too, right? For you to handle. You know, everybody else is, you know, things that are, the burdens that they're carrying too can come to you quite often. So, but I would say the focus still has to be on the kids and we are here. They are our clients. I say all the time, you know, we have the best kids and we have to believe that. And so,
What I would say is, is, you know, keep the focus where it needs to be and that's ultimately on the kids that we serve. And it's, and now you're doing that as a principal for an entire building, but there are going to be some decisions that you make that's going to be what's best for a kid, maybe even on an individual discipline situation where the teacher wants one thing, the parent wants something, and you have to, you have to do what's best for the kid in that situation. And that teacher may not be feel supported.
for whatever reason. So you have to be able to do that, but understand that that's why you were put in that chair. You were put in that chair because you are a leader, because somebody saw something in you to lead an entire building. And so, you get the opportunity to make that decision. And some of those things can be very life-changing as well for students. just, I mentioned this the other day in our, is get a praise box, find something that you can put notes in.
J.J. (25:08.389)of praise over the years and then get those out. Put them on an album, find those things because those are gonna be important later on. You know, from whether it be from staff or students or parents. So that would be my advice.
Grego (25:23.27)Recently, I told a teacher, and this was like May 15th, and this was in the principal's handbook that they gave me, I had a bit of a melodramatic moment. And I was talking to this teacher and I said, good grief. I'm just like Shell Silverstein's The Giving Tree. I give, I give, I give, I've got no branches. I give, and now I'm simply just a stump. That's all I am. I'm just a stump. There's nothing left of me.
Rick Sola (25:47.625)Ha ha ha.
Grego (25:53.004)And of course we laughed and I thought that really is the principalship. We give, we give, we give. And then suddenly there's just nothing left but a stump. But you know what, over summer, you grow back into this great, big, powerful Kansas cottonwood tree and then throughout the year, you know, you're losing everything, Shel Feverstein.
Rick Sola (26:18.347)Yeah.
Grego (26:20.732)but it always comes back and it feels so good when you do give and it comes back and you still have that capacity to give.
Rick Sola (26:30.734)That's a great analogy. love it. There's a theme wrapped in there somewhere. I'm trying to figure out how to incorporate that into a school wide theme. Maybe that's a little dark of a theme. I don't know. That's maybe a little melancholy or something. no, everything that you both just said is just so great. to be able to capture that here and like I said, hope people will hear this because there's so much there, especially those who are getting into the profession.
Grego (26:39.368)You
.
Rick Sola (27:00.716)Or maybe they're just finishing their first or second year where you really feel beat down and you talk about thick skin. It takes a little time to really get comfortable with that because you're building that confidence and all that. You know, I know a big part of, especially for both of you, because you care so much about your communities, the school that you're stepping away from. I know there's a lot of prep that is and has gone into.
leaving in a good place for the person who's stepping into your chair. Just talk briefly about what are some of those things that you made sure to do to ensure that your community in the building is really left in the best possible place for that person.
J.J. (27:49.428)You know, I'm glad you talked about that. was just talking with Leah, Dr. Cogswell, will be taking the principalship at Santa Fe Trail. And it's funny how things kind of come across like Twitter or whatever happens to be just at the right time. But I just, it was about, you know, basically about transition. And it talked about how, you know, are you building something that is strong only when you're there or also when you're out of the room?
And can you be a cheerleader for what happens next? And is there momentum to move forward? And I think that that is really, really good. It's really hard. I I found it hard, right, to kind of step away and say, okay, I won't be here or I'm not involved in planning and decision making for next year at this point. And that's not easy, but what you have to realize is that it's not about you.
first of all, and you have to, it's really about the kids and moving forward and, you know, sometimes change is good. And so, you know, I would just say that, understand that, you know, your legacy is about what moves forward in that situation, not necessarily about what was left behind in that situation. So that's kind of how I've looked at these last, you know, couple of months as it's gotten closer to the end.
Grego (29:11.912)Well, JJ, I'm glad that you have you expressed that it has been hard, especially with a new person. I have felt that immensely and then told myself this shouldn't be hard. But after 25 years, I opened the building, I've hired everybody. I've planted bushes like you. I've I've trimmed every. My DNA is all over this building.
Rick Sola (29:12.354)Great.
Grego (29:36.284)with sweat, blood, tears, and my life. And so giving that up to a new leader has really been challenging for me, because this has been my life, my passion, Regency Place. But I love the successor, Tricia Putoff, and...
I've really worked hard to make sure that she has every success possible. Everything is going to be done for her. I've got files ready. She's going to come into this clean office, which is not right now. And the year is pretty much planned for her. And then she gets to take that and do what she wants to. And I will be totally supportive of whatever comes up. I've tried to include her in all of our end of the year events so that everybody knows that we are aligned and good friends. The community knows that we're good friends.
which adds comfort to the transition. And strangely enough, I received a picture from a former staff member taken probably back in 2007. This is me.
Rick Sola (30:45.207)See that, yeah.
Grego (30:45.896)Eilish Man Bag that was, you know, very popular in those 2000s. And here's Tricia, who was friends with people in my building and we were at a staff function. And we're both talking, laughing, jamming, dancing. Who would have known that in 2025, she would be taking over the love of my life and I'm gonna be okay with it.
Rick Sola (31:12.728)Yeah, what a great picture to have that unearthed at this point and that's pretty cool. I'm assuming she's seen this, right?
Grego (31:16.156)Yeah
Grego (31:22.76)Oh yes, yes. We, we...
Rick Sola (31:25.088)Is it gonna be put up in the building? It really should.
Grego (31:30.408)Well, it's a family friendly building, Rick, with family friendly language and imagery. And probably this was at a favorite watering hole back in the mid 2000s that's probably no longer in existence. And I'm thinking that perhaps another PLC opportunity for the community to us getting along might be more appropriate.
J.J. (31:36.424)Hahaha.
Rick Sola (31:41.1)Yes.
Rick Sola (31:56.27)That is an answer only someone with years of principal experience could provide. That's fantastic. You know, I'll say the last couple of months, maybe it's the last several weeks or maybe it's the last year. Talk about or just share what's been your favorite memory.
Grego (32:04.008).
Rick Sola (32:20.074)over the kind of, I guess, just the home stretch. And so wherever you want to put that, but as part of your retirement, you you both have alluded to some of, and I've seen pictures on, on Twitter of some really great things and your communities, they love you. But what's been one of your, favorite memories of, cause I've heard it so many times before and Greg, actually you said this at the district retirement that, you know,
You find that you hear so many great things when you retire. It's unfortunate that we don't hear those things until we retire. But what's been your favorite memory over the last couple months?
J.J. (32:56.338)For me, really, I told my staff, made it very clear, and like Greg talked about to a directive that people don't follow, I made it very clear, I thought, that I didn't want anything. just want to walk away, right? Well, you know.
that didn't happen, but you know, it was great. So I think one of the favorite memories I have is the, we do a spring show at the end of the year and Rick would know what that's all about, your cheerleaders and drill team and you know, put on a performance and they had gotten from my wife a list of like some of my favorite rock songs, cause it was a rock and roll theme and they did a montage of those songs, tribute and then.
I got out there and was dancing with them, had the Brett Michaels wig on, that kind of thing out there, you know, because it was us dressing up for the event, and that was really special. And that brought goosebumps, and still does, I have goosebumps right now thinking about that, and a tear, you I think that will always be.
Rick Sola (33:51.351)Yeah.
J.J. (34:06.592)you know, an amazing thing. And the fact that the kids took the time to do that and that the sponsors to put that together, choreograph something and have it go off, that was amazing. And so that's one that I will always take forward. And then I think just the number of cards and emails and things that I've gotten, you know, that I've received has been tremendous from the community. They see it. You may not always hear it all the time, but they do recognize
and appreciate the work that goes in and taking care of their children.
Grego (34:43.57)JJ, I was like you, I was thinking, okay, let's keep the celebrations minimal, but at some point I didn't have control over it and they weren't listening and I just had to lean in and go with it. And that was really tough for me to be the center of attention and have all this thrown at you that really is so validating for you as a person, as professional, and as your career.
Rick Sola (34:43.586)JJ,
Grego (35:14.332)But after you kind of get used to it and you open yourself up to it, it really does help bring, I think, some closure to our careers and the power and legacy that we've left with this district. Again, I will say, I had a moment where a former parent called me.
I saw the name on the phone and I had an immediate, it's the last time I talked to this parent eight years ago. In June was a knockdown drag-out, not kind conversation at all about some critiques that things weren't brought up and it wasn't positive. You know, I held my own and I saw that name and thought, my, well that parent had called
and wanted to share that the boys were doing exceptional, going to college, had one graduating this year, and that their best years were at Regency Place. And he just wanted to let me know that. And he remembered the last time we had visited. And he had thought about calling since then, but this just felt like the right time. And I thought, another example, do the right thing.
Rick Sola (36:32.962)Wow.
Grego (36:37.362)You don't always have to get the last word, Mr. O'Borne. And that does come around. And that disgruntled parent that...
Extended the olive branch eight years later With something I really remember as much as I do cards and everything here that doing the right thing and Being a human being is so much what this job is all about and we lose sight of it It's hard because there are so many pressures and we're trying to be effective all the time and you just want to get this done but relationships and being human
That's how you get it done.
Rick Sola (37:22.444)Yeah, that's awesome. What a gift too, because you know that's something that I think so much in education we we don't see the fruition. Things come to fruition that we may have planted and to be able to have that eight years later. What a nice gesture on on their part and that you remember that so so clearly. You know, like I said, I have seen and heard of and then of course our district celebration. So many great things on on your behalf and in.
It's just great, greatest to see that two very deserving principles and for the record, going to miss you both greatly at our district meetings and just connecting with you. But I also know that you're the kind of people that are just a phone call away and you'd be willing to talk about anything, but just two of the best. I want to leave this with just quickly your plans now for the future, because I know
August is going to have a different feel. And JJ, I know you've got a little bit of an educational road ahead of you still, but I know it's going to feel much different. I say August. It's really like your summer is going to feel very different. So what are those plans here in the upcoming school year?
J.J. (38:39.654)And so I will be in charge of in-school suspension at a middle school in Park Hill School District and be an hourly employee and looking forward to that. I coach girls basketball. I think this is a good transition before my ultimate goal is to get back in the classroom.
as a social studies teacher. And so I'm looking for this transition time and had an opportunity yesterday to go work with some of the kids at a basketball camp. And it was so much fun to be back in the gym, knock off some of that coaching rust and learn and like, well, this is different than how I taught it 20 years ago, but that's okay. Let's learn more. And so I'm super excited about that, you know, and,
being able to work with kids and try to make a difference, difference individually with students. Take some of things that I've learned and put in place at CNFA Trail. And then eventually though I want to get back into the classroom. That's where my heart is and continue to coach.
Grego (39:45.82)JJ, I admire you so much for, you know, continuing having your feet and dabbling in education. That's great. I'm honestly scared to do that for fear that this school for 25 years has been the love of my life. And I would feel like I'm cheating if I were to do something else, you know?
Rick, you're so in tune. I am not looking forward to August because I know I'm going to be having, you know, I should be posting class lists. I should be doing this. So I plan to be out of town in Cape Cod during August to be entirely away from that so that I'm not going to be too focused. But look forward to...
having a life outside of school, which I really haven't. All these years I've been so school focused. As I've told my staff when I announced this, Regency Place will learn to survive and thrive without Mr. O, and Mr. O needs to learn how to thrive and survive without Regency Place.
So that is my goal is learning how to thrive and survive without the school schedule and being effective and Mr. Snap, which by the way, this doesn't work at home.
Rick Sola (41:08.706)Hahaha.
Grego (41:10.96)Snaps don't work.
Rick Sola (41:14.222)I don't think they would work at my home either.
J.J. (41:17.204)I just tried that on this call and got a dirty look. So I'm just saying, you know, yeah, it wasn't for my dogs either. It was like, you know, so yeah, there you go. I like that.
Grego (41:17.476)Hahaha!
Grego (41:33.616)It's a big adventure. I really don't know what to expect. And I guess we work all of our lives to get to this point. And I have faith that it's all going to work out and be great.
J.J. (41:48.306)Yeah, I would just echo there, Greg, because I mean, it's a little bit grieving, right? I mean, there's a little, even though it's so hard and there's so much and, you know, and, you know, I hated a countdown, you know, a countdown of days. I just, didn't like countdowns, you know, but it is a little bit of a grieving process because when it becomes such a part of who you are and what you do, it's your identity.
You know, right? And so now that has to change. And so I agree with you 100%. It will feel different when you've done this your entire life. And for me, that's all I've known, because my parents were educators, right? And so I have not known anything but going to school and doing school things since, you know, since I was a little kid. So.
Rick Sola (42:38.966)Well, really profound there and just really awesome to hear. just everything as I'm thinking about just this whole talk, everything that has really been talked about this whole cool coffee podcast is created to celebrate the principalship. And I can't think of any better way than to hear two amazing principals reflect on their career and share some advice and talk about next steps. There's just so much about the principalship that
is hard and challenging but so rewarding and I hope nothing but the best for both of you as you embark on a summer that will be entirely different than it has been for many, many years. And Greg, figure out that watering hole that picture was taken into and then when you come back from Cape Cod in September, October or whenever, let's all get together and...
And we'll just, you can catch up and hear about things and perhaps be reminded that, no, that's been a really good couple months that I've had not having to worry about all this stuff.
Grego (43:45.393)You
might even bring back that man bag and treat you both to a healthy beverage.
Rick Sola (43:53.378)Yeah, there you go. There you go. That sounds perfect. I'd be totally up for that. And guys, thank you so much. And as a testament to both of you, trying to schedule this, it was incredible because we're in summer and I know Greg tomorrow is actually the last official day of contract, but like it was dancing around commitments because you're still meeting, you're still working, you're still doing things for your building. This has not been checkout mode for the last few weeks or whatever.
You're working, you would talk about working bell to bell, you guys are working bell to bell. So thanks for all that you've done for education, for your communities, for your people. And thank you for coming on to this show here today.
Grego (44:35.846)Rick, your listening skills, your hosting skills, your paraphrasing skills are remarkable. I mean, this is like late night TV with your host skills. Seriously. So I'm gonna give you some positive snaps.
Rick Sola (44:54.414)Well, thank you very much. I thought I was sensing a little teetering on pandering or sarcasm or something, but no, thank you. Thank you so much. It's been awesome.
J.J. (44:55.522)You
Grego (44:56.381)your town.
Grego (45:04.68)It's genuine. Genuine.
J.J. (45:07.028)Well, I will echo that because Rick, you and I go way back and Rick likes to give me a hard time, but we are also big planes, trains, automobiles, fans and brothers in Seinfeld in that. And so I, you know, I will just say that you do a great job with this, right? And I'm not saying that in some sarcastic Seinfeld way, like.
Rick Sola (45:17.058)Ha ha ha.
Rick Sola (45:29.166)Well, you're.
J.J. (45:32.34)or anything like that. You do a great job with this. And in all seriousness, the fact that you're highlighting, because I think people can forget about the role of the principal sometimes, right? And not understand that we're human too. And you're bringing that human element to this. And so thank you for doing that. I hope that you keep doing this, because this is great.
Rick Sola (45:56.77)Well, you're very kind. And we made it through this whole talk. And there was not one single Seinfeld quote or reference the entire time. That's pretty remarkable. there you go. Well, guys, thank you so much. Have an awesome rest of the day, weekend ahead, and an awesome summer to you.
Grego (45:56.968)Agreed.
J.J. (46:06.718)We'll make up for that. We'll make up for that at that watering hole.
Grego (46:11.186)True.
Grego (46:18.888)All right, thank you.
J.J. (46:19.38)All right, thank you.
 

CC#70: Debriefing the 2025 USA-Kansas Conference

In this episode of Cool Coffee with Kansas Principals, host Rick Sola welcomes back familiar guests, as well as a couple new guests, to reflect on the recent USA Kansas Conference (2025). The conversation highlights key takeaways from the conference, including the importance of networking, effective leadership strategies, and the role of student leadership in shaping school culture. The principals share their insights on effective delegation, the challenges of leadership, and the significance of taking time to recharge during the summer.
Chapters (timestamps do not account for intro)
00:00 Introduction and Guest Introductions01:33 Reflections on USA Kansas Conference09:10 Keynote Highlights and Takeaways15:10 Effective Delegation and Leadership21:21 Working with Top Principals26:01 Summer Plans and Unplugging32:15 Final Thoughts and Networking Opportunities
Connect with this episode's guests:
Dr. Todd Dain -- Shawnee Mission South Principal (X: @SMSouthTDain)
Mr. Mark Mahoney -- Shawnee Mission South Athletic Director (X: @SMSRaidersAD)
Mrs. Kelly Whittaker -- Ottawa High School Principal (X: @kelwhitt217)
Dr. Johnny Lewis-- Ottawa High School Assistant Principal
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Contact the host: @MrRickSola, rfsola@olatheschools.org, or KPACoolCoffee@gmail.com
The mission of the Kansas Principals Association, an organization committed to educational excellence and the lifelong success of all students, is to develop and support all principals through optimized learning, collaborative leadership, networking, and service.
Read more about the KPA HERE.
 
FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPT (AI generated)
Rick Sola (00:01.932)Hello and welcome to Cool Coffee with Kansas Principals in what will be our last official full feature episode of the 24-25 school year. We'll relaunch again in August. But we have some guests here today and it's appropriate to have a couple of these guests because they are friends of the show, been on here multiple times. And one of them was our very first full feature with Dr. Todd Dane, who is joined also by his assistant principal, Mr. Mark Mahoney.
Welcome, Todd Mark.
Todd (00:34.456)Thanks for having us guys. Good morning. Happy to be here.
Rick Sola (00:38.144)And then also on the other side, we have also frequent guests on the show. Mrs. Kelly Whitaker joined by her assistant principal, Dr. Johnny Lewis of Ottawa, Kansas. I should have mentioned Shawnee Mission South. I think we know that, but for Todd Dane and Mark Mahoney, but then Kelly and Johnny from Ottawa High School. Guys, thanks for joining.
Kelly Whittaker (00:58.799)Thanks for having us on this gloomy Tuesday morning.
Rick Sola (01:04.31)Well, the last time I recorded was with Brittenhart and the power literally was going out on us and it was much worse. So this, this isn't quite as bad, but we'll take it. So summer is in progress. We all just connected last week, just less than a week ago, we were at USA Kansas, which is what really this episode is really featuring is just the USA Kansas conference, which brought a lot of really good material and content.
I know there were some presentations that we were even a part of. But want to hear a little bit and share out kind of bragging on the conference, but debriefing the conference a little bit. And so we'll just jump right into it and kind of get into some of the more meaningful sessions. And we've got five of us here talking, so it can kind of just go free flowing. But I'll just open it straight up with.
You know, when you think back to USA Kansas 2025, the 54th annual conference, what was the number one takeaway for you? And maybe we'll start on the shiny mission Southside, either Mark or Todd, as you left USA Kansas.
Todd (02:20.408)Well, I'll tell you what, I the thing for me every time, I think it's the same. It doesn't mean that this year didn't shine, but every year for me, it's just the ability to network, to connect, and learn from colleagues across the state, and get great ideas. I, you know, there's some...
really exciting sessions that we attended. But I think just getting ideas from others and sharing those ideas has been the most impactful for me. And as a first time guest there, one thing that I took away was.
was so well organized, it was very detailed. With the ability to go to a session and then be able to unwind with a group of people and talk to them about what's going on in their buildings and share different ideas was super impactful for me and something I can take into the summer and the next school year.
Rick Sola (03:18.252)Kelly, Johnny, as you come back to Ottawa, and I know you're meeting Kelly, we're talking kind of before we hit record here that your 12 month contract, you're working all summer. A lot of those ideas that you get from conferences like this kind of percolate and then they develop and then they come to fruition in August. What was something that you walked out of the conference with?
Kelly Whittaker (03:41.313)I walked out, so there was a student leadership group, was shared by Jerry Johnson, he's the high school principal at Holcomb High School out there in western Kansas, and I really enjoyed listening to him and Joe Coles talk about how Jerry has taken leadership, student leadership groups with his juniors and seniors and really just transformed the culture within his building and more importantly built the capacity through his students to be leaders. He made a comment that we always talk about and kind of grumble.
about how our kids don't know how to be leaders, but we don't teach them how to. And I probably am the queen of saying that around my building. So I was really excited to listen to him share a little bit about his journey and his story. And I've already emailed him and looking forward to connect with him and pick his brain a little bit about what that really looks like and how it might transition to a building that's about three times the size as he is. So just kind of curious on what that could look like for us.
I think for me, I left there feeling really hopeful about the state of education in Kansas and just some of the positive things that are happening there. Last session where we just kind of heard lots of good news about education in Kansas was good for me to hear and see and made me grateful. One of the sessions that I loved, I went to a session on our behaviors and our kind of emotional regulation impacts student regulation and so it was
talking about how to help teachers get emotionally regulated when they're dealing with students who are dysregulated. And so two minutes into that session, I was texting one of our teachers who's really passionate about that same kind of thing. And we're ordering books and planning professional development around ways we can help our teachers center themselves when students become dysregulated or tap out and find some help and just identifying some triggers and some skills that they need to help.
regulate themselves when they're in those moments. So that was just kind of some good nuts and bolts things that I took with me.
Rick Sola (05:40.12)Kelly, you had mentioned seeing Jerry Johnson from Holcomb High School. I was in that session. I didn't realize you were in there, but exactly what you said is what I wrote down to come back to is how often we have leadership groups in our eighth grade, at every grade, but our eighth grade, we have some leaders. We want to have them be influential students. And I really asked myself, how do we teach them to be a leader?
other than say, you're a leader and here's some activities we're going to have you facilitate. How do we actually instruct them on what leadership means? How to be a leader at a middle school? That really stuck out to me and I really appreciated that session from Jerry and Joe. Johnny, you just mentioned you were connecting with your teachers. I guess a question for all of you.
Are you intentional about or do you or just kind of as you go to these conferences do you reach out to your teachers and kind of make it very publicly known what you got out of these conferences? Is that something that you try to do when you go away to these conferences?
Kelly Whittaker (06:56.291)think when it's applicable, absolutely. Anytime that we hear a good idea or something we could bring back to whether it's our building leadership team, maybe a small group of teachers that could lead some future professional development, we always are processing and trying to do that when we feel like it's right. Not that you're going to try to emulate somebody else and you want to be just like they are, but if someone's got a great idea and we know that that's a gap or a point of struggle in our building.
And how can we take that information and build some capacity through our team to do some great things for our students as well and learn from their expertise in that area.
Todd (07:34.394)Yeah, I would echo that and that when we go to the conference and bring back an idea or even just
sometimes you just bring back a question, right? And I oftentimes go back to my building leadership team with a question that I have from a conference and how can we apply this here at Shawnee Mission South or how can we make this relevant for kids? And I think one of the most prevalent pieces that we're focused on is making school relevant for teenagers in 2026.
Right? We have to continually evolve and make school relevant for young people. And the traditional high school, the traditional college-bound path and everything else that we all think about school is rapidly changing and evolving. And we have to continue to evolve and meet the needs of our learners. so those are the questions that I bring back to our building leadership team, oftentimes with different ideas and solutions from other principals, and then using that to fit what
we need here.
Rick Sola (08:41.08)It's been brought up already a couple times, just the conversation that you have with other principals. You know, we all connected in this room last week at Wichita, not during sessions, but during in-between times or after times. And there's so much valuable PD, PLC, principal PLC that occurs kind of informally at these conferences. That's so great. I'm going to throw out a
I guess a subject from the conference last week and it just will just do reactions here. Let's talk keynotes.
Kelly Whittaker (09:21.078)yeah!
Rick Sola (09:22.008)Yeah, oh yeah. There were a few. We'll just start it off where the conference started. How would we, you know, just, we're debriefing the conference. Let's debrief the keynotes. Who wants to launch into that one?
Todd (09:44.27)Yeah, so I, you know, I I was so excited to have coach with us and share that story of of his of you know his team and young man that made all those shots and I think. That's not a new story to me, but I think it's good to.
Kelly Whittaker (09:50.659)the parade story.
Todd (10:05.366)remind ourselves why we do this and what we're all about. if the answer to our why isn't kids.
then we're in the wrong business. so I always get excited and emotional whenever we bring it back to students with special needs and that hits home with my family and what we live with. So it's always powerful to me that it comes back to our why and why we get excited and fired up about this thing that we do in schools.
And I'll take a note from Johnny, I called a couple coaches Friday morning, getting ready for this week and camps and summer weights and just try to get the enthusiasm I took from kids and how powerful they are and what we mean to kids. How far it goes just by loving kids and telling how much we appreciate them and kind of just puts a little fire in your belly. And I wanted to share that message with some of our new teachers and some of our veteran teachers that are getting ready to interact with kids.
in the school but not really a school setting this summer and want to get them kind of excited about the summer and next year.
Kelly Whittaker (11:20.215)And Rick, I always enjoy listening to Anthony McDaniel and Jessica Bernard, the two lawyers that presented at the end. mean, they weren't really a keynote, but they were a main breakout session for everybody. And I always enjoy going to their sessions because they talk about really tough and scary topics and they do it in a manner of which one, we can all understand. Two, they always make it very applicable to our everyday lives as educators and administrators.
And they just do it in a light-hearted but serious manner. So I really enjoyed kind of having that breakout at the end where they got to talk to everybody at the conference that last morning.
Rick Sola (11:59.648)Yeah, the team that I was with, had several from our district and there were some other lawyer sessions specifically with AI and how it's being used and how it can be used from a parent to type up a message, questioning, challenging perhaps some of the things, decisions that are made and so forth. And you can ask AI to kind of beef it up and make it sound like it's written from a lawyer and how AI is getting used in that way.
just kind of that frontier of AI. But certainly, anytime we hear from attorneys and people who are dealing with this, it's certainly applicable. You said scary. It can be when we think about that. I'll bring up the first keynote, the drummer, Mr. Schulman. I'm going to bring it up because two reasons. One, I got to be featured during that
that speech because I was selected and I received a drumstick at the end of it. you know, there are different things presented, but there was something in particular that stuck out and I wrote it down. And just kind of in a nutshell, Mr. Shulman is a career drummer and has worked with really the biggest names in the music industry all throughout his career. He showed a clip from Pink and I'm not sure if you remember, he actually showed several, but there was one
Todd (12:57.294)you
Rick Sola (13:25.932)where she gives him credit for the work he does, but for being the most positive person in the room all the time. And he explained that it dawned on him at that moment that he wasn't asked to be on all these different groups, whether it was Billy Idol or Pink or Cher or whoever, because he was the best drummer, that it hit him that it was what he brought to the table.
as a person and beyond that. And I just thought that was really a really good kind of aha for him, I'm sure. But just some insight on, you know, the things that we bring to the table, kind of the old adage, like you don't have to be the smartest person in the room. But how we present and carry ourselves is really important. And so I really did appreciate that message that was shared in that first keynote. And then
Kelly Whittaker (14:08.527)Mm-hmm.
Rick Sola (14:21.24)kind of Todd to your point, the coach that came in. I've heard that story before. I've seen the video before. But oh my gosh, you talk about emotional. And I actually got a book from him afterwards. he just, I mean, there was a long line, but he just sat and kind of talked and just a very genuine guy. So some really, really strong keynotes and presenters that were brought into USA Kansas for sure. Any other sessions? I just want to kind of, you know,
be able to share out as part of, you know, that's something we do here in the building I'm at is we just, we sit down and talk about, okay, you went to this, okay, talk about it, let's share out. Is there any other, are there any other sessions that you attended that kind of for the good, not just for those in this room, but those who might be listening to this podcast that's worth sharing out?
Todd (15:10.412)Yeah, you know, for what it's worth, I...
I want to give a shout out to Zach Murray and his team at Chanute High School. I thought they did a really nice job of sharing some of the changes that they put in place there, really to be very intentional about their purpose in navigating student leadership and student behaviors. Specifically, I love the idea of what they've done with their freshman introduction class, their freshman orientation course that they created for all
freshman that's required for them as an elective and that's one of those things that you talk to them afterwards and say hey how did you do this and who can teach this and where's the curriculum from and you just want to steal ideas and I've stolen a lot of ideas from other people I steal from Kelly all the time but that's one of those things that I thought was really a big takeaway for me and what they've done at Chanute and hopefully we can find a way to make that work here in Shawnee Mission.
Rick Sola (16:12.48)Awesome.
Kelly Whittaker (16:13.967)I went to one by this guy named Todd Daines, that was pretty good, it was on delegation and what I appreciated about that, we got to reflect on it afterward and one of the things I appreciate about Kelly is that she's really reflective and so after we were, you know, part of that session she was able to kind of be vulnerable and ask some questions about how she delegates and like asking me questions about how I perceive the way she delegates and just being reflective about it. So I think that was good for
Todd (16:18.222)You
Kelly Whittaker (16:43.981)to just think about how we work with our team and work with people in the building. So helpful stuff.
Rick Sola (16:51.584)So we got the presenter himself right here, Dr. Dane, in a nutshell. Can you share a little bit about that delegation that you talked about in your session?
Todd (17:02.508)Yeah, you know, a little bit we focused on how to build capacity in your team and specifically the delegation triangle. it's actually a piece from Model and Edix and
how to how to rotate that delegation triangle where you can release some of that control and a lot of times I think building principles struggle letting go struggle with letting go of control and most most building principles got that way got to that position by out working out hustling out studying their peers and as a building principle that
model doesn't necessarily work. Because you can burn out very, very quickly by trying to do it all. And you really have to be trust willing to trust your team, to trust your administrative team, your office team, your teachers, to build some of that leadership capacity in them to make sure that you maximize your opportunities there in the building. it's just really about how you can
leverage that delegation model and let go of a lot of the responsibilities and share that, share that leadership capacity and in the end empower your whole team.
Rick Sola (18:27.232)Yeah, I'm curious, what would you say, Dr. Dane, as far as, you sometimes I see that, you you mentioned that burnout and, you because it's hard to delegate and sometimes it gets challenging to delegate when you feel like you've been burned by delegating before. It's almost like, I always feel like sometimes micromanaging is bred from
Todd (18:46.018)Yeah. yeah.
Rick Sola (18:53.962)inept or if someone not following through is like, I'm just going to do it. How do you recover from that or what would be your thoughts on that?
Todd (19:02.562)Yeah, I take it all kind of with a grain of salt. And when I have conversations with principals, sometimes I'll say, why don't you delegate that to your athletic director? Or why don't you give that to an associate principal to do? And sometimes their response is, well, I would, but they'll screw it up. And I said, sometimes the best thing to do is to let them screw it up, and then
use that as a learning opportunity to help teach them through the process. And anytime we navigate one of those scenarios here, I always take the blame, right? So I shoulder the blame for any of those mistakes or errors or missteps and understand that it's my responsibility. And then ultimately, it is my responsibility because I didn't do...
I didn't do my job in making sure that I detailed everything in the delegation process. I didn't give them enough information on the front end. I didn't do enough check-ins. I didn't follow through with the reflection and the details at the end. So I think there's a process to effectively delegate. I've been on the end where I've delegated and I didn't give enough background and I didn't give enough structure. And then I had to
correct my approach as the delegator to make sure that those team members know exactly what the expectation is on the back end and why we have to do things a certain way or what the parameters are. So again, I do think as principals sometimes we're shy about delegating because we have been burned and
I've the one thing that I've learned. I've been the principal here for 10 years now and in that 10 years I've had 14 different associate principals and I've gotten better at delegating. I've gotten better at training them.
Todd (21:00.994)But it's a process where I also know when I have new ones come in, I've got to allow them to make mistakes because that's when they learn too. And I got to keep giving them opportunities to grow in the process. that's one of my objectives as a principal is to help grow my team, to get them where they want to be.
Rick Sola (21:21.59)Right, now that's really great and thanks for going into that a little further and I think that's something we all can relate to certainly. Question for Mark and Johnny, what is it like working with the principals of the year?
Kelly Whittaker (21:37.207)you
Todd (21:39.15)It's great. I've known Todd for 20 years. I come from a place where I know exactly what he wants and what he needs and his work ethic. So it actually makes my job very, very easy. He has an expectation. I know that if it's not met, he'll tell me. And that's OK, because that's how we grow and get better. And I'm constantly growing.
Kelly Whittaker (21:59.054)Yeah.
Todd (22:04.002)That's what was so great about the conference was to talk to other people that live in your world to kind of bounce ideas off of them, see how they learn from their mistakes and how to help me grow as an assistant principal in AD.
But it's an honor to work with Todd and our team. there's never a dull moment at school. And it's not work to me. I enjoy it. I'd like to go back to the conference because we're under construction right now. And it's real now. We're back to work. But it's pleasure.
Rick Sola (22:35.031)Ha ha ha.
Rick Sola (22:38.634)Awesome.
Kelly Whittaker (22:40.655)I kind of ditto what Mark said. I really appreciate that the expectations are very clear. The bar is high.
And if you don't meet it, there's going to be a direct conversation about it. Not a mean one, but a helpful, reflective one. And I really appreciate that. I appreciate receiving feedback if I'm not doing well and also hearing when I'm doing well. And I get both of those things and I really appreciate that. I think one of the gifts that Kelly has that I really, that helps me want to come in to work with her every day, she does a great job of bringing our focus back to what is best for students in this moment and kind of putting aside.
listening to all the different sides of things, then to kind of pull us together and say what's best for kids in this moment. And you know, that's my own why every day. And so it makes me want to get up and come here every day and it's inspiring. And I also just want to mention that I have a couple of times when we were recruiting teachers this spring and we knew they were a little close on which school they were going to go to. Kelly has never mentioned it, but I have said, hey, just so you know, you got a job offer from the Kansas principal of the year. you know, any
Todd (23:49.198)you
Rick Sola (23:49.44)You
Kelly Whittaker (23:50.603)thing we can do to try and get them, you know, I'll do it. So, but I do think it's reflective of this is a place where we take what we do seriously and good things are happening here. So it's a, it is a selling point when we're talking to prospective new staff. So I've tried to use that as well.
Rick Sola (24:07.544)Well, those are both really nice answers for both of you. was like, you you put that out there and we're streaming, like, who knows what they're going to say? Like, I mean, I didn't know if we'd be 10 minutes in and like, another thing, you know. No, obviously two top notch principals and that I was admiring the rings that come with it at the conference. And so I wanted to bring that up, but obviously two top notch principals.
Todd (24:19.63)you
Rick Sola (24:35.82)But also having talked with Kelly and Todd, I know they speak often and very highly of their team, which is both of you. Mark, we had a chance to talk quite a bit at the conference. It was good to catch up with you. both shared a district in our past, but haven't really chatted very much. that's really the value. I think some of the biggest value of these conferences is just that networking and talking. Mark, you mentioned
wanting to go back to the conference and because of the construction kind of made my mind go to November, we have the KPA conference, which is a mini version of this and it's extremely powerful as well. And so just an early plug for that coming up. But yeah, the networking is just just an incredible piece and a lot to be to be brought back to our buildings. And I think all of our buildings are going to be better for those who attended this conference. So
A very critical piece, I think, in our world is really kind of at that time where we're at right now, which is summer. The pace is a little different. We're about to break for summer, if you will. At the same time, personally, I have found summer sometimes doesn't lend itself to that mental break because you're gearing up so rapidly and quickly for the upcoming year. But it is important to do so. So from each of you, just quickly,
What is it that you're gonna do to really kind of be intentional about allowing yourself time to unplug, recharge, because we hear that often, but I don't know how often we allow ourselves to do that, but what's something that you're gonna be doing this summer just to kind of let yourself get away?
Kelly Whittaker (26:19.065)for me as a high school administrator. Our evenings are very busy and so we're constantly go, go, go, go, go during the nine months of the school year. And so my favorite thing to do just in the summer is that when I leave work, I can actually leave work and very rarely in the summer must I finish a task before tomorrow morning in order to walk in and feel good about where I am. So I tend to use my evenings more just to be with my family, to work out, to just kind of...
relax and unwind. One fun thing I am doing this summer, I bought my mother tickets to see Caitlin Clark play in Indianapolis. so I'm going to be, hopefully she gets her little hamstring healed so I can go and watch her play in Indianapolis with my mom. But that's just kind of what I try to do is connect with my family and do those things that we just don't have time for during the school year, especially as a secondary administrator, because we are at work all the time and at activities in the evenings and on the weekends.
Rick Sola (26:54.487)Wow.
Kelly Whittaker (27:15.439)I wouldn't trade it for the world, it's important to take advantage of that down time and that slower pace.
Rick Sola (27:21.889)Absolutely.
Kelly Whittaker (27:22.851)Yeah, kind of the same thing. have a almost, he'll be six actually next week. I have an almost six year old and then a 13 year old daughter. And so, you know, they, they miss me on those nights when I'm doing ball games and things. So just a lot of extra time with my kids, time at the pool. My daughter is a huge fan of the band, My Chemical Romance. So in August, they're doing a reunion towards first time they've toured in a long time. So in August I'm taking, Kelly's actually letting me miss.
one of those first days in August when teachers are back so that can do this. We're flying to New York to watch My Chemical Romance at Citi Field and my daughter is so excited that she and I get to do that together. So she's like super pumped. like talks about it every day. We've been planning it since that was her Christmas gift. So we've been planning it for a while. So yeah.
Rick Sola (28:11.254)That's awesome. And that's kind of going back. mean, they're a little bit of a throwback band at this point. There we go.
Kelly Whittaker (28:17.219)Yeah, she's old school. She's a cool kid. She's cooler than her dad at this point.
Rick Sola (28:22.008)That's awesome. We'll enjoy that. What a special time with her. How about Shawnee Mission South over there?
Todd (28:31.822)I'm super excited both my kids walked down the hill and are college graduates about three weeks ago. It's not gonna be relaxing cuz they're back home in the last four or five years, but we're super excited to have them home. And I'm a lot like Kelly at four o'clock for the most part. I don't take phone calls and don't have games to rush to so I gotta be back home with a.
dogs and my family and looking forward to just pool and relax and hopefully just try to unwind. But it never shuts off, but it's a little bit slower now.
Kelly Whittaker (29:05.967)Mm-hmm.
Todd (29:08.27)Yeah, I would say the same. I you know, I I leave work and I go home to my my real boss, the doctor Dane and I orders from her and but our kids are grown now and so it's actually a time where we can spend a little more time together as a couple and just unwind a little bit. I am going to spend a week in Seattle. So super excited about that with any SSP and illuminate. So we're going to go to Seattle and celebrate Kelly Whitaker and the POI is of 2025. And then I'm going to
Rick Sola (29:13.889)You
Kelly Whittaker (29:34.639)Woohoo!
Todd (29:38.176)be presenting at the United Conference there after that piece. So I'm excited to present again at the national level and
went to Seattle last fall and. Spent some time with the Superintendent there from Tacoma and he said that it basically rains every day in Seattle, August through May, but June and July is nice, so I'm looking forward to seeing Seattle in July.
Rick Sola (30:03.96)You
Rick Sola (30:10.006)That's awesome. And that kind of Kelly, we brought up the principle of the year, but kind of in a nutshell, the next steps for you with that you're headed to Seattle. What does that look like?
Kelly Whittaker (30:20.055)Yeah, I get to go to Seattle. I don't really know what it fully looks like because I've not experienced it before. Todd has been able to, but I get to go to Seattle to connect and network with other principals of the year from, principal of the years from other states. I've already been on some podcasts and been able to do a lot of really cool networking with them. So I've kind of gotten to meet some of them ahead of the experience. And there'll be some learning. There's a really cool gala, fancy dinner that we get to go to and you get honored.
They will select the national principal of the year at that banquet. And then I'm not, unfortunately, don't get to stay for the full conference because I'm going home to watch Katelyn Clark play. So going back to Indiana for that. then November 5th and 6th at our conference, we'll get recognized and honored one more time. I have told Carol Letty this multiple times. I think every principal should have the luxury of being a principal of the year at some point in time.
Rick Sola (31:00.216)Hmm.
Kelly Whittaker (31:15.695)You can take full advantage of it or not. The networking opportunities that have been afforded to me from the moment that I was named the 2025 Kansas Principal of the Year to right now have been honestly humbling. And I'm getting to meet and learn from some of the best administrators across the country and just very grateful for that process. I am a super reflective human. And so my team might get annoyed by all these great principals and leaders that I'm meeting and just trying to.
get ideas from them about how we can continue to make Ottawa High School a better place for kids.
Rick Sola (31:48.652)That's great. Well, and what you get from them, bring it back to us and we'll just keep paying it forward, passing it forward. so to all four of you, thanks for joining today. I know it's summer, so it can be a slower pace, but there's no shortage of things to do and to take some time out of your day to jump on here with me. I do appreciate that. And I look forward to catching you all here again soon.
wherever that may be across the summer, whether it's the KPA conference in November, but hopefully sooner than that. Any other final thoughts before we go?
Kelly Whittaker (32:22.351)Just hope to see all the listeners at the KPA conference in Wichita November 5th and 6th. It's a great opportunity. It's a networking. That is really where I feel like my journey as an administrator in Kansas took off. I went by myself. I didn't know anybody, got connected, met some people, got involved in the KPA Board of Directors and here we are today. So cannot encourage that moment for other administrators more. Just need to be there on November 5th and 6th.
Todd (32:53.176)Same, I had the same experience. The first time I went I didn't know anybody. And then I ran into Kelly and look out.
Kelly Whittaker (33:00.399)you
Rick Sola (33:02.296)Well, 100 % because I still feel fairly new, but same deal. And I've said it on here before, but just joining, obviously doing some of this now, but it's all the connections that we've made. I have had texts with both Todd and Kelly on a candidate, either coming to or going to me or going to them or whatever. So that's just one example. But then the things that we learn from each other are just priceless. And it just helps.
Kelly Whittaker (33:28.249)So.
Rick Sola (33:30.552)and having that network, it's comforting too, because there's some challenging moments and we know that and anyway, before we...
Kelly Whittaker (33:37.511)Rick and I think great friendships come from it and in our line of work it's lonely sometimes. We can't always have a lot of friends within our buildings just because of the nature of the work we do and so just being able to go a couple times a year and reach out to people and stay connected whether that's on social media or via text message or the occasional phone call like to me that fills my bucket because it gets lonely sometimes when you're an administrator because you just don't have a confidant.
to be able to problem solve. so the networking, the friendships, the learning, the reflective moments, I just can't encourage people to join Kansas Principles Association more.
Rick Sola (34:16.93)Well guys, thank you once again. I appreciate you and all that you do. Look forward to connecting here sometime soon and hearing about how great your summer was. Otherwise, have a good summer and we'll see you around.
Kelly Whittaker (34:27.363)You too. Thank you, Rick. Thank you for everything you do. Thank you.
Todd (34:29.836)Thank you.
 

CC#69: Principal Chat w/ Dr. Britton Hart of KASB

On this episode of Cool Coffee w/ Kansas Principals, Dr. Britton Hart, Assistant Executive Director of Leadership with KASB, shares his journey through education, highlighting the importance of servant leadership, humility, and teamwork. He discusses the challenges and responsibilities of being an administrator, the significance of building relationships, and offers valuable advice for aspiring leaders in education. The conversation also touches on the end-of-year reflections and the collaborative efforts needed to support students and staff in the educational landscape.
A Principal Chat with 2016 Kansas Principal of the Year and current KASB leadership
Dr. Britton Hart
Assistant Executive Director of Leadership with KASB
Contact Dr. Hart (email)
X: @DrBrittonHart
Chapters (timestamps do not account for Cool Coffee intro)
00:00 Introduction to Leadership in Education02:06 Britton Hart's Journey in Education08:31 The Role of a Servant Leader14:07 The Importance of Humility in Leadership17:19 Advice for Aspiring Administrators19:35 End of Year Reflections in Education22:21 The Value of Teamwork and Collaboration
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The mission of the Kansas Principals Association, an organization committed to educational excellence and the lifelong success of all students, is to develop and support all principals through optimized learning, collaborative leadership, networking, and service.
Read more about the KPA HERE.
 
FULL TRANSCRIPT (generated by AI--timestamps don't account for CC intro)
Rick Sola (00:01.612)All right, hello and welcome to Cool Coffee with Kansas Principles. I'm here with Dr. Britton Hart, Assistant Executive Director of Leadership for KASB, but also the 2016 Kansas Principle of the Year. Did I get the year right? All right.
Britton Hart (00:15.798)You did, you did. That just means I'm getting old.
Rick Sola (00:19.106)Kansas principal of year by at the time the Kansas Association of Secondary School Principals, Britton, welcome.
Britton Hart (00:27.97)Yeah, welcome to, yeah, thanks for having me. I did this years and years ago when Trevor Kurtzen was doing it. And so I enjoy talking about principles with principles and in that service role still.
Rick Sola (00:41.27)Yeah, I've had Trevor on here and he and I actually spoke before this even got started because I knew he had done this and, know, okay, Trevor, tell me, tell me your thoughts and secrets and all this thing. So, but yeah, it's been a lot of fun. And really the timing of this is I think apropos with USA Kansas coming up and a lot of our state educational leaders will be under one roof at the conference. And so really excited to
to go there here just a week away and really just continue to build upon those connections that I really think all of these organizations are really positive about. And it's really a major perk of the KPA, USA Kansas and KASB. do you see that? My power just went out. We're live. I'm still recording, but power just went out and it just came back on.
Britton Hart (01:29.954)you just left.
Rick Sola (01:38.452)well, we're back. We're back. But it's not really a live show, but it's a one-take show. So you just kind of get what you get here. But yeah, a little bit of context on that. We just had a torrential downpour at dismissal, which is now about an hour ago. But I just got in and soaked. And I appreciate Britton for being patient, because it was something else. Britton, as we.
Britton Hart (01:45.166)Yeah, no worries.
Rick Sola (02:06.452)As we get started here, your road in education goes all the way back to the classroom and up to and through the principal chair to where you're at now. But we'd love to hear about your road to your current position.
Britton Hart (02:19.874)Yeah, I'd give a shout out prayers to Grinnell and those folks there and superintendent, teachers and staff. I know they're, they're finishing up their year, but had a, had a tornado and obviously similar to hopefully you guys won't have any tornadic weather, but maybe just rain. Ironically enough, I started my teaching career in Olathe. I was teacher and coach at Olathe North, really enjoyed my time there and still have many ties and Mr. Herman and I are still.
been friends ever since and just a great district and a great school. Started teaching in 2000, I guess, so this is my 25th year in education and technology education teacher, track coach, had a couple of sponsorships, but really loved the kids there and loved the love students to be honest. That's why I got into the field and still love students. And that three daughters has come up through.
our system. My last one is still in school. It's going to be a middle schooler next year. so a little bit, a little bit bittersweet, but also a little nerve wracking to be a middle school parent. But that's been good. I transitioned from teaching at Alisa to a building level assistant principal, athletic director. I always thought I wanted to be an athletic director. And it's one of those jobs is you
you want to do it and you're excited to do it. And then when you actually get into it and you understand what the role is, there's a whole bunch of responsibilities. And really to be fair, that's where our parents and our students live and thrive and breathe there. Sometimes too much. Maybe, maybe need a little clearer focus on academics sometimes, but a lot of things move in parts and enjoyed that at Prairie View, which is just south of Lewisburg there. Left there after two years and went back, went to Emporia.
In a similar role, much larger district. I grew up around Emporia. I'm an Osage City grad and so I was a little bit closer to home. My mother-in-law and father-in-law were there and obviously still connected with Osage quite a bit. served many roles at Emporia, was assistant principal, athletic director, did career in tech, did SPED, did a lot of different things outside of just athletics.
Britton Hart (04:42.026)I became the principal in 14 maybe and was in that role for five years and then really wasn't looking to leave. My former boss, Dr. Jordan and Dr. Heim both were at the Kansas Association of School Boards and I can remember we were talking about can you come up and visit about a position and you know naively I kind of said well I'm not even sure what the School Board Association does.
Rick Sola (05:01.538)you
Britton Hart (05:09.902)I was really well connected in the principal association, was president elect that year. You know, just was in my mind living a dream, You know, I my own kids in my building and was enjoying seeing them every day and doing really good things from an academic and a culture standpoint and an employee high. And we decided to get our graduation rate up over 90 % at that point.
Rick Sola (05:20.663)Yeah.
Britton Hart (05:37.838)Just a lot of great things going on. And as you know, Rick, you hit that range in between that two to four years and some of the fruits of your labor, the change starts to kind of take hold. And so we did a lot of good things that I think really impacted students. And I'd like to think that while those things are still in place, but you started to get that excitement that everybody kind of going down the same path. And so when I talk to...
with Dr. Jordan and Dr. Mechel. Brian was gonna transition into a deputy role and like we'd like for you to work with, we primarily work with superintendents and boards. And so we, the ability to get into a board is through typically through your superintendent. And so like Dr. Yeager, for example, when I work with the Olathe board, typically he's the one that I coordinate with and then your board president, et cetera. And so.
The transition I've kept though between USA Kansas, I sit on the KPA board with Kara still as a liaison. We know most superintendents come through your role and so we think that's really valuable to make that connection. Not necessarily work day to day with principals like USA or KPA does, but have an awareness of who are some of these individuals that are up and comers that are going to be our next future superintendent leaders.
our job is to try to get the best people, kind like yourself, in those roles in front of the school board. School boards don't do that, you know, very often we hope. And so they don't have practice at how to hire superintendents, so we provide that service and think that's a very valuable process and also a really important process, not just for the students, but staff and the community that they may be leading. And so that's kind of a short pedigree of kind of where I started and where I'm currently at.
Rick Sola (07:33.026)Yeah, I appreciate the breakdown of the KASB and I hate to just say this out loud, but I wasn't entirely sure. Just like you said, when they approached you and kind of not knowing the ins and outs and it's not something I'm super familiar with. And of course we're on the same board with KPA and we've talked and come across each other multiple times, but very fascinating. One thing you mentioned early on is you talked about the
Yeah, you wanted to be an AD and there's some hidden roles and you didn't, you you see some things that go on from outside, like, I want to be an AD. And then you get in there and like, look at all these little things that you also have to do. I wonder how much of administration is that, you know, I kind of wonder about those, those incoming administrators or those who are pursuing degrees through the university. And then when you get into that role, it's, wow, this, this is part of it, you know.
Britton Hart (08:13.506)Yep.
Britton Hart (08:31.224)You know, I've seen over my years, that there's individuals that go into administration and they go into it with like a servant mindset. I kind of consider myself a servant leader. That's what we do at KSP. If you call tomorrow and you need help, we're going to try to help you in some way, right? I think a good administrator, whether you're an assistant or even the executive leader like the superintendent,
those people going into it with that mindset. It's kind like if I walked in your building and there was trash laying on the floor, would you pick it up? It's just one of those mindsets where you just do whatever it takes to get the job done, and you do it at a high level, and you model those, what I like to think of as high quality leadership skills, and you model those things, and other people, in most cases, will follow.
What I see is a gap though, and my colleagues at USA and I talk about this frequently, that sometimes people go into those roles and they don't have the right mindset. It's not that their mindset's bad, it's just not one that's maybe conducive to thriving in that role. And when they sit in that chair, they get in that seat, kind of my earlier description, I didn't know I had to do all those things. And I didn't sign up for that. And so that can be a little bit problematic. And so same way as I take
those experiences and as we start to help with superintendents get placed or we help train superintendents or grow them, giving them those kind of information, giving them an opportunity to talk about those things ahead of time so that they can make sure that when they do fit into that role, just like your role that you're in, you want it to be a good fit for you and your family and you want it to be a good fit for the school and the staff there as well. And sometimes I see that a little bit as problematic. The younger the administrator
gets, at times you don't have that foundational knowledge going from teacher to principal or principal to soup. And at times that can be devastating not having some of that experience. And so you can overcome it, but also it's helpful to have quality experience in the classroom, quality experience in the principalship before you maybe take that next step to ensure your success.
Rick Sola (10:45.174)Yeah, I was a seventh or eighth year educator when I made that jump to administration and I've worked with some colleagues and friends that have made that jump 20, 25 years in and they just have, they have that foundation. There's a bigger foundation there. And I recognize that, especially in hindsight, I'm in my 15th year administration now, but in hindsight, you know, some of those things, they come at you fast and furious and oftentimes early on.
It is kind of a first time or a not as common situation that you are dealing with or that you've had to deal with before. This will be a shameless plug here, but you mentioned the modeling of picking up trash in the hall and things like that. That was actually brought up. We had a panel episode with interviewing and we had several principals on there about just the interview process and walking around the building. And that was brought up as far as when you're walking the building and there's a little piece of trash on the floor, if that candidate
picks up that trash. That's definitely in the wind column there for that.
Britton Hart (11:45.794)Yeah.
Britton Hart (11:49.592)the year.
You know, I always look for also, you know, as we talk about this, I look for somebody that, you know, gravitates toward kids. And so when you're on an interview, do they naturally talk to students? Do they naturally, you know, kind of gravitate toward staff? Or are they really just kind of really formal? And so it's interesting how leaders, everybody is watching, right? And so how do we carry ourselves through adversity? How do we carry ourselves through times of celebration? But those are things that I think are so
important with the experience that you build over time. But another shameless plug though is high thrive on networking and the people that are connected in the field.
You don't have to be the smartest person in the building. You don't have to be the smartest person in the room. What you need to be, though, is a connector. You need to establish those relationships. I'm going to learn so much more from you, Rick, than you're ever going to learn from me. And with that mindset, I think you grow yourself. We're lifelong learners. It's not really an old cliche. It's the truth. And how do we surround ourselves by people that are better than us?
And I've always been really fortunate to have good teams and be on good teams. But I never felt like I was the best on those teams. I felt like I was way below everybody else. And I learned from those people. And thus, I feel like that's a...
Britton Hart (13:15.586)gratitude or an opportunity for success there because you try to find the best people that share the same values and you can do anything I think in this business that will impact learning and that's to me the cornerstone of our jobs.
Rick Sola (13:32.118)Yeah, I think you're tapping into humility a little bit when you talk about just being a connector, but you're not the smartest person in the room. You don't have to be being able to listen. And I think humility is such a piece of leadership and being in a building. And so I love to hear all that. And I kind of think of like the authenticity or being genuine that just resonates across the board, whether it's teachers or students or parents.
It only helps with situations, especially challenging situations.
Britton Hart (14:07.054)Yeah, mean, I mean, I'm gonna say majority cases, nine and a half out of 10 times when somebody came in, student, staff, parent, board member, superintendent, even that were upset with me or upset at a situation that I was helping deal with, all that, most of the time, they wanna be heard and they want their opinion to be valued. Doesn't mean you agree with them, it just means that, hey, Rick, I heard what you said, I'm sorry you're dealing with that.
versus automatically getting your guns up and trying to protect yourself or the situation. And those are things that, be fair, I think you learn along the way. And that servant mindset and that humility you're describing, I think those things all kind of mesh into the leader and the person you become.
But it takes practice. I'm going to screw up again tomorrow, but hopefully the next day I won't make the same mess up, right? And so that's how we get better, I think, as people. And it's certainly a great lesson for students to learn, because this world is hard. And you're to have a lot of failures. I heard a great thing, and it's a former colleague of mine. Most people go after success, and they think,
happiness is driven by the amount of success you have. And he said, which I thought was really spot on, happiness drives your success. Success doesn't drive your happiness. And so in this big bad world, there's going to be some great things. There are going to be a lot of bad things too. But if you can kind of have a mindset or kind of a mentality of, I'm going to be happy through these situations, good, bad, or indifferent, that will drive your success. And I thought that was really good.
Rick Sola (15:50.594)That's great. Sorry, my phone just went off with the severe weather. It's fine. Everything's fine here. No, I love that. And I was writing that down as you were talking. you still there? OK.
Britton Hart (16:02.883)yeah, I'm still here. I I coughed just a little bit. I didn't want to cough in your ear there.
Rick Sola (16:07.232)No, no, you're good. There's so much going on right now. I don't know if a listener might think I'm on the top of a ship or something, but there's a lot happening behind me. But that happiness driving success, that's pretty profound, really. especially, one of the things I love to do is work with aspiring administrators and having the conversations that...
kind of talking through a thought process and kind of like to your point, I always say there's a million ways to do lots of things and I'm not saying I've got it 100 % right, but this is the thought process behind that. But I think some of it, you know, are we chasing success or are we chasing happiness and then what drives what? I just, really like that. You know, as you sit now and you're several years out of the building, but as you work with principals and if you were asked,
Britton Hart (17:00.942)Thanks
Rick Sola (17:01.108)you know, by an aspiring administrator or maybe even a sitting principal for some advice in something, especially now that you can kind of see it, you know, maybe from a different distance, maybe a little more clarity. What advice would you give to an aspiring administrator or maybe a newer administrator?
Britton Hart (17:19.832)You know, I like that question. It reminds me of too, as we're talking about interviewing people, is when you ask someone, why do you want to become a principal? Why do want to leave the classroom?
I think that's always very telling to say, well, I want to help more kids or I want to impact more learning versus, hey, I want to have more free time or I want to make more money. And we know those things are not true because as you get into this role, your responsibility goes up, just like your phone's buzzing, you got wet sitting outside waiting for the parents to pick their kids up. And so that responsibility just continues to get bigger. But the thing that I think, the advice that I think is so valuable
is when things are going well, you give credit to your staff and your students. And when things are going poorly, you take ownership and you take responsibilities to make those things better. And those things...
As a young administrator, if you can pick up on those things early on, you're gonna be great in this business. But if it's about you and it's about you trying to find, hey, that was my idea or hey, this is my building, drives me crazy when I hear somebody talking about their building and they say, this is my building. No, it's not my building, it's our building. It's a kid's building. The only reason we're here is because we got students coming through that door. And so how do you set the culture of your building?
Kind of like Todd Dane does. mean, he's a culture dude. But it starts, think, with culture. And it starts with that understanding of we're getting into this to help each individual student. And we're getting into this for the benefit of someone else and not for myself. And I think that's such a, for young administrator, you want to know what you're getting into. And I think that kind of helps kind of guide. Are you doing it for the right reasons? And is it going to be a good fit for you?
Rick Sola (19:17.452)us back to that servant mindset, which carries through so many phases of a building, all phases, honestly, because really everything could become your job to some degree, everything will come across your desk.
Britton Hart (19:30.039)Yeah.
Rick Sola (19:35.062)So it's May and I know what it's like in the building. You know what it's like in the building, but what's May like for where you're at, at KASB?
Britton Hart (19:45.506)Well, that's an interesting question. So I live with a teacher. My wife is a teacher. And so you can appreciate everybody trying to end up the year and stressful.
I think my role, what I experience on a day-to-day basis is emails and phone calls with similar things just at a different level from board members and superintendents. And they're like, you know, they're stressed too. They need a little bit of a break, just like you need a break. And they need a little bit of downtime to be able to reflect because right now there's just not a lot of downtime. And the pressure that...
I experience as a principal is very similar to what our board members.
feel, what our superintendents feel, it is this constant demand of their time, their opinion, their everything. And anymore, it feels like the polarization of those demands are coming from different angles, just like you're experiencing sitting in your chair. And it just gets old dealing with that and it gets difficult to deal with that. And so I feel like at times, I don't mean counselor like people need counseling, but I feel like
I'm a listener. I'm like, hey, tell me what are next steps that you might try. Tell me some things that you're thinking about, or how did it go when you implemented that, and trying to help coach people through those tough situations, because you can't own that for them. All you can do is equip them with and instill them with some responsibility of power and some leadership that they can do it. And that's, hope, why they call, and I hope they keep calling, because they feel like I value.
Britton Hart (21:24.972)their role and it's respected. Each role is important no matter if you're a teacher or a school board member or parent. Those are all important. And so how do we work together to build a coalition that best supports students?
Rick Sola (21:41.9)Yeah, I love that. You can't just pick up the phone and call everybody about certain things that come across. In fact, it's very limited on who you can really talk to, especially if you're just kind of ground down. this time of year, mean, we see it with staff and teachers and students. And there are tough things that come up that really wear you down. But I love that role of how you articulated it. You're there sometimes just to listen and
Sometimes people just need that because you can't, there's just not everybody to call for certain things. So, no, that's great. Before we go, USA Kansas, we'll see you out there next week.
Britton Hart (22:12.344)Yeah.
Britton Hart (22:21.464)you
Britton Hart (22:26.184)Yeah, yeah, so I saw they're almost at 1000 registrants, which is exciting. And so yeah, I plan on being there. I'm out of town Wednesday, but I'm presenting on Thursday and then then we got meeting with superintendents, I believe on Friday. So yeah, excited to see some former colleagues and some people that that I haven't seen for a while. It's like once a year, get the band back together. And so I was looking forward to going so.
Rick Sola (22:51.542)Yeah, it's a great timing too. We're all wrapped up or wrapping up for the most part, and it's just nice to connect. I remember talking with you last year at this. It had been a while since I had been, but having gone last year. And I'm also presenting on Thursday. So just looking forward to learning from others and sharing a little bit myself. And it'll be great to connect with you. Hey, real quick before we take off here.
Bragging on your people. We always finish with a big brag on the people you work with and K-A-S-B and brag on your people.
Britton Hart (23:29.998)We have 11 people that make up our leadership department. We go all the way west to Garden City and Goodland and all the way east to Shawnee Mission and Olathe. so.
We got retired superintendents, we got a couple recovering principals, we got a few people that been in the HR world. We even got a board member that make up our team and then our coordinator. But just got dynamite experience and I value when we get into a space together.
It makes you smile because you're proud to be a part of that group. And like I said earlier, it's about surrounding yourself by people that are better than you. And if you have that ability and that comfort in your own leadership style.
Boy, to me, if you have a dynamic team, you can accomplish anything. And to me, that's a huge role of the role that you and I play, because you want to put the right people on the right seats, just like Jim Collins would say. And so I feel lucky to work alongside them each day. And I hope they would say the same about me if roles were reversed. So yeah, I feel fortunate to be there and certainly feel fortunate to serve school districts in the role I do. I think it's a, I always call it the ripple effect.
Rick Sola (24:39.106)Yeah.
Britton Hart (24:47.6)out there but it's an awful big pond and that's something that's motivating to me to get up every day and do a good job for Kansas kids because there's a lot of them that need our help.
Rick Sola (25:01.25)Well, that's a great analogy. And again, thank you for the time. I know there was a delay on getting this started today and it's busy, but really look forward to connecting with you and so many others at USA Kansas. yeah, we'll see you here very soon.
Britton Hart (25:17.39)Well, hey, I appreciate the opportunity, Rick, and appreciate your leadership, what you're doing. I will tell you, I have to go back and look. I can remember Gene Haddock and I, we added the communications position on that board when I was.
a new young principal and it was all about just starting a Twitter account. And so you've taken it so much farther than we started for sure. And I think it's important to tell our message and it's certainly important to make it louder than everything else out there. Because what you're doing and what the leaders across Kansas are doing, just like our teachers, is so important. And unfortunately right now we're not getting the support from some of our other colleagues across the state, you know, and we got to stick together during times like this for sure.
Thank
Rick Sola (26:05.184)Well, I appreciate that. And truly, I mentioned Trevor earlier, you brought him up. He and I talked a lot and he broke the ice on this and really that's what this is all about. It's just celebrating the awesome things that are going on across the whole state. And there are so many and that's part of what next week will be about. I hope to get a list of others so they can share everything that's going on. There's a lot to celebrate and it should be celebrated. but thank you so much.
Britton Hart (26:31.774)Absolutely.
Rick Sola (26:34.658)Dr. Hart, have good rest of the week and we'll see you next week.
Britton Hart (26:39.094)Hey, thank you much. travels. We look forward to seeing you. Yep, take care.
 

CC#68: PBIS w/ Dr. Steve Archer of Delaware Ridge Elementary School

In this episode of Cool Coffee with Kansas Principals, Dr. Steve Archer, principal of Delaware Ridge Elementary School, shares his extensive experience in education and his insights on Positive Behavioral Interventions and Supports (PBIS). He discusses the transition from middle school to elementary education, the importance of building relationships with students, and the challenges of implementing PBIS. Dr. Archer emphasizes the need for a supportive school culture and the role of positive reinforcement in shaping student behavior. He also offers advice for educators looking to implement PBIS in their schools and highlights the welcoming community at Delaware Ridge.
Dr. Steve Archer
Delaware Ridge Elementary School
Bonner Springs-Edwardsville USD 204
Connect with Dr. Archer: archers@usd204.net
Chapters (AI generated--times do not account for intro)
00:00 Introduction to PBIS and Dr. Steve Archer06:30 Transitioning from Middle School to Elementary Education12:30 Understanding PBIS: History and Implementation18:28 Challenges and Misconceptions of PBIS24:41 Building Relationships Through PBIS30:22 Advice for Implementing PBIS in Schools34:21 The Community and Culture at Delaware Ridge Elementary
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FULL TRANSCRIPT (AI generated)
Rick Sola (00:01.686)Hello and welcome to Cool Coffee with Kansas principals. I'm here today with Dr. Steve Archer, principal of Delaware Ridge Elementary School in Bonner Springs, Edwardsville, USD 204. Welcome, Steve.
Steve Archer (00:15.278)Thank you, Rick. It's great to be here.
Rick Sola (00:17.824)Yeah, I am excited to have you on here in part because you're going to be presenting at USA Kansas here in just about a month. And you're going to be talking about a topic that I have really found myself enjoying and getting into, and that is PBIS. And we'll get into that in just a bit. But once again, at the end of a long day, I just want to say thank you for coming on. And it's a Tuesday here. It's April 29th.
no shortage of things occurring in our schools and on our calendars. So to add this, I really appreciate it.
Steve Archer (00:55.086)Well, you know all about that full calendar, so I appreciate your time as well.
Rick Sola (01:01.28)Yeah, well, it is also a fun time of year and we'll just start off here, first question, probably what everyone wants to know is are the Chiefs going to be moving out to your neck of the woods in Bonner or KCK or?
Steve Archer (01:15.458)You know what, my primary concern is keeping them in the Kansas City area. And as long as we can do that, I'm gonna be a happy Chiefs fan.
Rick Sola (01:20.724)Okay.
Rick Sola (01:25.068)Yeah, it's funny because I was looking up, I wanted to see exactly where Delaware Ridge was. I was like, oh my gosh, you're really close to the speedway. And I know there's been rumblings of the chiefs. at least as of this recording, we don't really have any information. well, Steve, we'll start with where I like to start is just kind of a it's more or less a, I guess, introduction of yourself, but really your road to the chair of to Delaware Ridge Elementary School.
Steve Archer (01:53.55)Sure. Well, Rick, my road has been a very long one. This is actually my 36th year in education. I started in middle school, and if you told me all those years ago that I'd be an elementary principal, I wouldn't have believed it because I started as a middle school teacher.
did that for seven years, then between a couple of districts was a middle school assistant principal for a while, and then had a great opportunity to become an elementary principal. So I had worked up to that point in the Kansas City, Missouri school district, Raytown school district, and then went to Park Hill for the last 16 years in Missouri, then was able to retire from the Missouri system, but
I love working in school and so I couldn't imagine actually retiring. So I was very, very fortunate to see the opening here in Bonner and when I came here I could just tell it was a very special place and a place that I would want to take my next step. So I was delighted when they called me and offered me the position. So that's how I ended up here at DRE.
Rick Sola (03:05.451)That's great. I'm sorry, you've been you've been DRE, okay, that'll be helpful for me here, but you've been there how many years? Your first year in Kansas, okay.
Steve Archer (03:13.698)This is my first year in Kansas, I just retired from Missouri at the end of the last school year and immediately started here.
Rick Sola (03:23.818)wow, well welcome to the Kansas side of things and you know maybe the Chiefs will after all follow you over to Kansas so how about that?
Steve Archer (03:26.83)Thank
Steve Archer (03:31.086)Well, you know, I am a native Kansan. I actually grew up on the Kansas side of things. you know, one thing I've learned over time is we're a really great community regardless of which side of the state line it is. And so I feel very fortunate to have been able to grow up in Kansas City and then have a really great education career here too.
Rick Sola (03:53.452)Well, it's really interesting being on the Kansas side. hear so often, and I have a lot of, have a really close principal friend who's retiring this year, and you just never know. Often we see the other direction. Our principals here, our educators here, we're going over to Missouri. And so to hear it conversely, that would actually make it kind of an interesting topic for this show. All the same, but no, well, very good. So.
Steve Archer (04:05.346)Thank you.
Rick Sola (04:19.818)You know, I'm 21 years into education. I've been in middle school all but one of those years. I had one year where I was teaching freshmen at the high school. We had a transition here where I'm at. What's the biggest adjustment from middle school to elementary that you would say?
Steve Archer (04:38.254)Well, you know, with middle school there's typically just the three year span. And so you get like those 11, 12, 13 year old kiddos in elementary. And of course my school also has a pre-k classroom now. And so we have everything from four to 11 year olds here. so...
What I love about elementary is we just get to see kids grow up over time and get to see them develop skills and develop their personalities. so that is a really big difference. But I guess a similarity between the two is.
Kids just need adults who care about them, you know? And whether they're little or whether they're middle school, and even though I haven't taught in high school, I know they do too. And so it's just that common thread that goes all the way through. But definitely differences between middle school and elementary would be a lot around supervision, I would say, you know, making sure that...
As I recall in middle school, would have passing periods and kids would come and go as they needed to. And here at the elementary level, it's much more controlled by the teacher and making sure that we keep track of the classes all throughout the building as well.
Rick Sola (06:00.928)Yeah, well, absolutely. kind of it's really a pretty natural segue. You just mentioned the importance of, you know, kids at all levels. Those relationships are so important. And certainly there's differences in logistics in a day and what that looks like at the three different levels of school. Some may argue that middle school, the three years of middle school feels like five years of growth, but certainly a lot of lot of growth and lot of
Steve Archer (06:25.368)Thanks
Rick Sola (06:30.988)But it's a good segue to PBIS and again, really intrigued and why I wanted to have you on. So you're gonna be presenting on this at USA Kansas here in about a month and those who may listen to this podcast are likely to attend. And so what I was really intrigued of, I was reading the description of your presentation is the reference to 15 years in PBIS.
Steve Archer (06:59.916)Yes.
Rick Sola (07:00.894)And so as a school, we were mentioning before we kind of went live here, but as a school that I'm at, we're in our third year of implementation, that conversation of longevity and keeping it going and, you know, it's constant involvement. Seeing 15 years is really, really intriguing, but I think a good place to start really would be kind of your history with PBIS. I know you're a big fan of it, a proponent of it. And so, you know, just, guess, starting off with
with your history, how did that start with PBIS and what was that hook that kind of led you now 15 years in?
Steve Archer (07:38.808)You know, at the time I was in Missouri and my school had really good kids and we just expected them to come in and do what we expected them to do. And they did for the most part. Some kiddos struggled a bit with the expectations, but a lot of them just came in and did the right thing.
And when I became aware of PBIS, one of the things that really struck me is we're not recognizing the awesomeness that these kids bring into our building every day. And you know, everybody likes a good out of boy, out of girl every once in a while, even if we're doing the right thing. And so just that acknowledgement and again, going back to the relationship piece, you,
those positives draw staff and students together and build those relationships when
I notice a student being respectful or responsible or safe. That's a really great way for me to let them know you make our school a better place to be. And so that was very appealing to me that we got a chance to thank these students who were doing the right thing and sometimes seemed a bit unseen. It also struck me that as we were doing that, we would be able to catch some of the kiddos who maybe didn't always make the best choices, but if we
caught them at the right moment, we could positively reinforce those things that we were going after so that we would get more of that with in a positive way rather than really focusing on the negatives.
Rick Sola (09:26.666)So pushback, challenges out of the chute, especially starting up a program. It's one thing to have it and tweak it and adjust it, but starting it up, what were some of those initial challenges maybe amongst staff and whether a community or kids and that sort of thing?
Steve Archer (09:47.086)Yeah, I think that is a reality. I had parents who said, why are you rewarding kids? They should be doing these things. And that surprised me because it was their children I was rewarding. So that was a little bit of a surprise and that wasn't a big voice, but it was definitely a conversation that we had to have. My take on that is I get positively reinforced a couple of times a month.
in the form of a paycheck that goes into my account. I love what I'm doing. I love doing the right thing. But it's great to get positively reinforced with that paycheck. Our kiddos obviously are not getting monetarily paid, but we all like having those things that we know we've earned.
From a staff standpoint, I think we sometimes have a lot of work to do to reframe some of our thinking around behavior because a lot of us grew up with the good kid, bad kid binary kind of thinking and with PBIS and with several of the models, it's more of looking at teaching that behavior and that it's our responsibility to teach
behavior just like it's our responsibility to teach any of the content that students come in contact with over the course of a day. And so I know for me,
Certainly I've changed my philosophy of behavior over the years. so I think with any of the staff members, we just have to be patient but also persistent in helping shift that narrative to it's our responsibility to teach behavior just like we teach content.
Rick Sola (11:36.16)Yeah, there's a really good quote and I'm going to totally butcher it so I won't even try to, but the essence is, you know, if someone's misbehaving, we teach this or it, I think you know where I'm going. I am not articulating it well, but the main point is when a student acts out, we, and then fill in the blank with it's a consequence of some sort, which, you know, to that point, I'm curious of your experience with it is, you know, one of the misnomers that
Steve Archer (11:45.73)Yes. I know exactly. Yes.
Rick Sola (12:05.74)I remember when we went through the development and we continue as our district works with this, there are consequences still part of PBIS. And I think there's this, maybe if we're not totally informed on PBS, we think, well, it's a token reward system for things that we should be doing anyway and kids can never get in trouble. But that's not accurate.
Steve Archer (12:30.286)It's really not. I work in a real life elementary school. I dealt with discipline today and there were consequences. However, consequences don't always mean a negative thing. It just simply means the outcome of the behavior.
And so I think that's one thing is to stop just assuming the consequences are negative. But then also, you know, in the vein of conscious discipline, there's a lot of focus on natural consequences and logical consequences. The more we can look at the consequences that we have in place.
and determine are they natural or are they logical and are we keeping them close to the behavior? You know, I think the closer we can get to the behavior and shaping the behavior...
We simply have to decide, are we wanting to our vengeance for a perceived wrong that a child has done, or are we wanting to teach them for the future? Are we wanting a short term, aha, I got them, or are we wanting a long term, I taught that child, and I helped them see a more productive way to do things. And I think the more we can look at the child's future and helping them develop those more
appropriate skills and that sort of thing, the less we worry about getting kids. That having been said, we do still have to have an orderly environment. There's a principle of BIST that says the classroom has to be as good or better when you're here, or you can't be here. And so sometimes I say that to kids, you know, your classroom needs to be as good or better when you're present. Did you make it as good or better? If not, what do we need to do to fix that?
Steve Archer (14:21.364)And so I do think that idea of there are no consequences with any discipline model can be a real misrepresentation. But at the same time, we need to do our own soul searching as the adults and decide, are we trying to get long term gain that benefits the child or are we just trying to get vengeance for some perceived wrong because they inconvenienced us today.
Rick Sola (14:49.502)It's a really good, first of all, that's a really good quote. I wrote it down. If you're good or it's a good or better when you're present or, you know, you know, there's certainly a mind shift and, you know, we're a few years in and, and I think we have a lot of things really positive in place and that we're kind of adjusting and evolving and reassessing. But it's interesting too, there's a mind shift for students. And I have had situations where I've had students in my office or I've been out at a
Steve Archer (14:56.13)video.
Rick Sola (15:18.102)football game and I've had to address a behavior and I've had the conversation, I've had the necessary consequences if you will, and they've responded the way I would hope and ask and eye contact, nodding, understand. And I'd give them a, we have tokens, I would give them a token and it's like, wait, I'm supposed to be in a fist bump to conclude it. And I said, look, you're not getting a token because you just, you know, did.
Action A over there, that's not what this is about. But when I called you over, you came over. We were able to have a conversation. We talked about our program, our values here in the building, which I'm gonna ask you about if you have one of the acronyms that often go along with PBIS. Because it's really all about, we have expected behaviors. And when a student provides expected behaviors, especially in a situation where they've maybe made a bad choice,
It's a mind shift perhaps, but it's not inappropriate to say, I appreciate that. Because the alternative is they could have run the other direction or they could have cussed me out or they could have done this or that. We were able to have a good conversation, address the situation, and hopefully it doesn't happen again.
Steve Archer (16:36.53)If you do need to address something again, how much more likely are they to partner with you the next time? Or how much more when they're tempted to do something, are they to think, you know what, maybe I don't do that? And so again, you're teaching for the long term rather than trying to catch them doing wrong. And that's really what PBIS is all about.
Rick Sola (16:59.062)Yeah, and really what you just mentioned there is I think why I like it so much is it encourages and promotes that interaction that can be very positive, even surrounding a hard or challenging situation or a poor choice. And it does, it builds those relationships, which goes back to the very start of this conversation. But it does not ignore or dismiss behavior, if anything.
It's an active program to correct it. So I was going to ask you, I referenced we use tokens here. What is your form of currency at Delaware Ridge?
Steve Archer (17:36.898)Yeah, we use the PBIS rewards app and so we have no physical tokens. All of ours is electronic. I will say it is a much more efficient system than when.
We started 15 years ago in my previous school and we had slips of paper and there were people who hand counted them to see you know how many have been handed out. I can open that app and very quickly tell you how many have been rewarded this month, how many for each category, each grade level, lots of very specific reports that I can get so that then we can move forward based on the data.
that we have. So it does make it a lot more efficient for us.
Rick Sola (18:28.332)Do students always know when they receive, I'm going say token, when they receive that recognition or does it just kind of appear in their bank or how do they know?
Steve Archer (18:39.97)No, they should know because really the token or the item, that is only part of it. I know when I catch a class in the hall, and this happens a lot and I'm very proud of it, but when I catch them in the hall and I stop them, you know, a lot of times I'll say...
I saw you before I heard you because you were so quiet and appropriate in the hallway and to me that says you were being respectful.
you were being responsible for your own behavior and you were helping keep our school safe. So you know what? I'm going to recognize you with not one, not two, but three points because you did all those things. so then they do know and a lot of times there's a place to put a comment. And if I'm recognizing the whole class, I'll enter that comment that says your class did a great job in the hall. And so then they know they're going to get those added. I will also say in the
classroom, one of the things that has been a benefit to teachers is they can recognize students with or without saying anything, but there you can turn the tone on or off with PBIS rewards. And you know I kid and say it's positively Pavlovian because as soon as they hear that tone
You can just see the shift in the body language and in the focus on the work and things like that because they know the teacher is noticing and they're looking for students to be that respectful, responsible, and safe student.
Rick Sola (20:22.848)Great. So your students, they have a device and the app is loaded on their device as well? Or is it a... Okay.
Steve Archer (20:27.946)No, the students don't, the teacher does. And so they can just use the app and they'll hear the teacher's phone ding. Or sometimes the teacher will walk through the room and say, Steve, I see you working really hard. I'm going to give you a point for being responsible or that kind of thing.
Rick Sola (20:49.6)We went round and round. That's why I'm curious because we talked a lot about tokens or electronic, and we ultimately leaned on tokens, and it has some challenges with that. The data collection isn't quite there as far as what you're describing. We landed on tokens for that kind of personal interaction, but it presents some challenges with every year we got to get the tokens back. There's always loss, and we got to repurchase, and there's a cost to the tokens themselves.
Steve Archer (21:07.309)Yes.
Rick Sola (21:19.692)You mentioned respect and responsible. What are your letters or posters look like?
Steve Archer (21:25.976)Yeah, so we had a building pledge before we started PBIS here in this building. This is the first year of our PBIS implementation here at Delaware Ridge. So we simply changed some of the wording. We didn't, you know, throw out the baby with the bath water and it says, I am somebody.
The me I see is the me I will be. I can be respectful, responsible, and safe. I can succeed. So that's the pledge that our students say every morning after they say the Pledge of Allegiance.
Rick Sola (22:00.716)Very good. And how about tier two? Have you had much work with that as you're building currently implementing tier two using the tier two model?
Steve Archer (22:10.574)we are, we do have some students who are part of our check-in and check-out. It's, you know, we're working toward developing those tier two and tier three interventions.
This year my main goal has been making sure that we have a solid tier one implementation, we have begun, you know, there are just some students who need that additional support of like a check-in, check-out and things like that. And so we do have that in place as well.
Rick Sola (22:42.956)We have found a lot of success with moving to tier two. We did a similar approach that first year. It was really all about tier one, trying to reach fidelity. Our kids, they know our values, ROCs is what we call it. then we, by getting into tier two, I feel like that's where, I think that's where a lot of value in PBIS is. That's where, you know, cause not every student is, know, tier one's not gonna just
be there forever. It's there for everyone, but it's not going to always fix a need or provide support. And that tier two has, you mentioned the check-in, check-out. We've had a lot of success stories with that. Most of the time, once the kids are in there and they get out, they don't go back in. Sometimes we have had a student or two that we reintroduced, check-in, check-out, but it's always successful while they're there. We're at the point of
Steve Archer (23:17.422)That's right.
Rick Sola (23:41.824)we're kind of broadening even from that part of the PBIS process, but very exciting. And when you have those success stories with students with challenging behavior, it's fulfilling, especially middle school.
Steve Archer (23:56.59)Absolutely. Yes, I remember those days. But you know, if we can build skills at the elementary that kids can carry with them into middle school, what kind of, I mean, that's a huge gift, not only to them, but to that middle school. To not just...
limp through and send them on, but to really help them develop skills that will help them grow as students and as people so that they can just use those in a variety of aspects of their lives. And again, it goes back to relationship, particularly with a check-in, check-out, or a check-in, connect. It's the relationship that really makes the difference there.
Rick Sola (24:41.558)So after this episode, and perhaps you'll have several principals in your session at USA Kansas, and someone's really intrigued, and they're like, I really want to take this to my building. What would be a piece of advice you would give to the upstart of the program at a building that hasn't had it before?
Steve Archer (25:03.374)It's definitely a team sport, if you will. This is not a principal thing. It is a building approach. Also, it is a framework. I came from a building that had implemented PBIS for 15 years. There are things that fit at Delaware Ridge. There are things that do not fit yet at Delaware Ridge. And to come into this building and
and expect all of those things to transfer would have been a mistake. So I definitely think you need to get, I think first of all, would do my research and find out about the premise behind PBIS. This is not a passing fancy. It's been around for a long time and it is an approach that has
the research and the evidence behind it. But then you also have to let your staff in on that.
and make sure that they understand that this isn't going to be the flavor of the year. This is going to be an approach that we take that we're going to build from the ground up in a way that makes sense for our building so that we can develop those positive relationships with kids. And what we're looking to do is teach behavior for every area of our building, classroom, assemblies, restrooms.
lunch, all of those things and really get all of that lined out with staff before the kids ever walk in the door.
Rick Sola (26:43.232)You know, one thing that I was really excited about when I started here, when we started PBIS, we have some neighboring shops and restaurants and things. you know, unfortunately not always were we the best representatives of, you know, after school and hanging out. And we tried to extend, we did extend our program across the street a little bit.
And we had a couple businesses that were willing to give out tokens and hang some posters and just show, of support it. try to, kind of to your point, from the elementary to the middle, I try to advertise this isn't just a Chisholm Trail thing or a school thing. We're talking about respect and ownership and that's a life thing. And so these are skills that you work on now, you hopefully sharpen. And sometimes we see that
two steps back in the process. That's where they're at in their lives, there's a lot of just kind of fulfillment with this program that has really been energizing even now that we're three years in, four years after the build of it.
Steve Archer (28:00.322)you're seeing good outcomes from that. I love that idea of a business partnership. I've not worked in a school that had a business close enough to do that sort of thing and so I
excited about hearing to hear that because what a great way to expand that out. know we've worked to add some things for our bus riders because it's very hard for a know one driver on a bus of all the students to take care of all their responsibilities to drive kids safely and to focus on that positive reinforcement. But we've come up with
with a little bit of a different approach. It's still in the spirit of PBIS though, and so that's a piece that I'll be sharing at the conference, just to talk about our initial successes with that.
Rick Sola (28:58.486)Well, and kind of to that point, that's what I really like about the program too, is it's customizable. Like you mentioned, what worked at your previous school either doesn't right now or it's not a good fit for whatever reason. And PBIS is a framework, like you mentioned earlier as well, but you can make it your own to fit your population and your community, is what I love about it. You referenced your presentation and...
teaser what what can people expect if they're going to be sitting in your USA Kansas conference here in a month.
Steve Archer (29:36.558)I think one of the things that I hope people will take away are several things, definitely it's a framework. And I am not a purist when it comes to behavior models because what they'll probably hear, what I know they'll hear is PBIS.
but they will also hear echoes of conscious discipline and they'll also hear pieces of this that we've brought into our work here at Delaware Ridge. And for me, it's about finding those positives that work within your school, but still being true to the spirit behind PBIS.
I think always keeping that teaching focus and finding out how you do that. And I'll just share how we did it or how we do it here and what we found works here. I mentioned partnering with our bus drivers who, you know, that's a very challenging job sometimes, particularly at the end of the day when the kids are kind of done and they're ready to be home. That can be a big challenge. And then another piece that I'll be sharing is how we
share some positives with parents as well. So we use some different approaches for that too, so that parents see that, you know, we care about your kid. We are glad they're here and we want you to know that they're a positive part of our learning community and that we don't take that for granted.
Rick Sola (31:14.048)Yeah, it'll be a great session and if anyone's listening to this prior to, definitely stop in. And I knew a little bit about PBIS where I'm at. We had a rollout probably 10 years prior as a district. I would say we've made a lot of adjustments and improvement and we've recast it and it's kind of the full, jumping in with both feet and it's been really, really positive. So looking forward to that. Steve, you're a year one principal in Kansas.
And KPA, it's a KPA podcast. What has KPA meant to you in the seven months, eight months that you've been with us?
Steve Archer (31:53.314)Well, I will say I've enjoyed the episodes of this particular podcast that I've been able to listen to and learn and just to get excited about some of the work that's happening in Kansas that I didn't know about before, you know, and so I'm really looking forward to going to the conference, going to sessions and continuing to learn because, you know, we work in education. We should continue to learn regardless of how long we've, we've,
been in education so I'm really looking forward to learning at the conference coming up.
Rick Sola (32:25.804)Have you been to the USA Conference, attended it before?
Steve Archer (32:27.662)I have not. I've always gone on the Missouri side to our MAESP conference.
Rick Sola (32:33.996)It's a great conference. I would also put a plug in, there's actually a KPA conference in November. So keep an eye out for that. It's a little smaller than USA Kansas, but it's in the same location, or it's in Wichita, but really, really strong conference and just great opportunities to network and learn from each other. Just fantastic. well, Steve, I'm gonna have us end on, you mentioned Delaware Ridge or DRE.
Bragg on your people here that you've gotten to know over the last several months.
Steve Archer (33:02.476)Yes.
Steve Archer (33:07.724)You know, I believe that some, most of the time you can really get the heart of the building by walking into the office. And when I walked into the school, it was very welcoming and I could go into details on that. But the bottom line is there was a tone in the office that welcomed me. And that has proven to be true across our building.
I say of the people who work here, they don't work here because they don't have other choices. They work here because they want to be here and they love our kids and
they love each other. it really is a wonderful learning community. And there are times that I will overhear people just laughing together or problem solving together or that kind of thing. And I just smile to myself and I'm just like, really? This is where I ended up. And so it's a very, very special school and a very special district.
I am surprised I didn't know more about this district before I came here, but I'm very grateful to be at Delaware Ridge now.
Rick Sola (34:21.472)Great, really nice words and just very neat to be able to come over and like you said, retire from one state on over here to another and to join a community that's so welcoming. And you're right, you can certainly feel a lot when you just walk into an office of a school. what an important message. Awesome for them to hear that. I hope they hear this, to hear you say that. But important for everyone to hear that because the office...
Oftentimes they're the ones that are interacting with the community, not us. Most of our parents are dropping lunches off or making phone calls. So, excellent.
Steve Archer (34:54.286)absolutely.
Steve Archer (34:59.64)That's right. Yes, and my front office, they're just some of the best of the best about that. Welcoming our families. Teachers come and they need something. They're more than willing to help with that. Somebody needs to step away from the office. Somebody else comes in and helps. That front office is such a hub of our building.
There are a lot of fun times that we have there, but then we also know how to take care of business. again, DRE is a special place. I feel very fortunate to be here.
Rick Sola (35:32.822)Great, well, thank you for your time. At the end of a busy day, a long day, and I look forward to, I'll meet you in person, hopefully, out here in Wichita in a few weeks. It's getting that close, so.
Steve Archer (35:45.004)It is getting close. Alright, thanks so much, Rick.
Rick Sola (35:47.98)Alright, thank you Steve.
 

CC#67: A Principal's Perspective - Rick Sola - Work-life...balance?

A Principal's Perspective: Work-life...balance?
Rick Sola
Principal
Chisholm Trail Middle School, USD 233
X: @MrRickSola
Adam Grant quote--7/12/2022
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CC#66: A Principal's Perspective - Courtney McCartney - Dance Through the Storms

Perspective Topic: Dance Through the Storms
Courtney McCartney Principal Frank Layden Elementary Frontenac Public Schools USD 249
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CC#65: A Principal's Perspective - Stacey Green - A Message from the Heart

A Principal's Perspective: A Message from the Heart
Stacey Green Pre-K-8 PrincipalStockton Grade SchoolUSD 271 StocktonX: @usd271sgs
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CC#64: A Principal's Perspective - Jeremy Thomas - Increasing Student Participation Through Enrichment Before/After School Activities

A Principal's Perspective: Increasing Student Participation Through Enrichment Before/After School Activities
Jeremy Thomas
Principal
Eudora Middle School, USD 491
X: @EudoraSchools
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CC#63: A Principal's Perspective - Mr. Heath Henderson - "If it were me, I'd want to know."

A Principal's Perspective: "If it were me, I'd want to know." (Todd Whitaker) 
Heath Henderson
Skelly Elementary/USD 490 Principal
USA Kansas Board of Directors
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CC#62: A Principal's Perspective - Rachel Buessing - The Importance of SEL on School Culture

Perspective Topic:  The importance of SEL on school culture
Rachel Buessing
Principal
Rock Creek Middle School
USD 323, Rock Creek Schools
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